the money system is evil
- Auteur de la discussion BrainEater
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Eniac
Neurotransmetteur
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- 12 Mar 2012
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- 34
We do need to change ourselves, but as a civilization not as individuals, but civilization IS bunch of individuals. But not all of our fellow earthmen are ready to change, or maybe they do not want to change, or they don't see changing is only obligatory. Therefore we must do something to open their eyes.
BrainEater
Banni
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- 21 Juil 2007
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i think they can only change themselves. so what we can do is try to show them what we think the right direction could be and that could stimulate their thought process, if they are somewhat open-minded or so. that's why we should be careful also.
in other words, it's probably better to simply make suggestions or something like that instead of trying to enforce your view/perspective. violence is not really a solution, if you ask me, and the fact that it's somewhat accepted as being normal
doesn't mean that it's the best thing to have forms of violence on various levels or so... like mental/emotional/spiritual...
well i think it's like this: some people are not ready to be unplugged and for some it's simply too late. :-? :tear:
and hmm i am rather convinced that if we would have to enforce our view, we would be no better than them and generally if we would have to enforce something i would say in most cases it would be speaking against that thing.
the question is why these people can't see themselves as whole persons. i think maybe there's the possibility that deep inside or so they know that what they do is wrong, but they can't admit it, not even to themselves...
the idea here is mental imprisonment and how they subscribed to it in the way that they are so much in a tunnelvision state with their minds, that the conditioned mind dictates their perception of what is real and what is not and this leads to
the inability of not even being able to imagine alternatives anymore.
i dunno lol... i think it's like they can't breathe in some sense or so lol... too much pressure. :o :shock: :shock: :shock:
peace
in other words, it's probably better to simply make suggestions or something like that instead of trying to enforce your view/perspective. violence is not really a solution, if you ask me, and the fact that it's somewhat accepted as being normal
doesn't mean that it's the best thing to have forms of violence on various levels or so... like mental/emotional/spiritual...
well i think it's like this: some people are not ready to be unplugged and for some it's simply too late. :-? :tear:
and hmm i am rather convinced that if we would have to enforce our view, we would be no better than them and generally if we would have to enforce something i would say in most cases it would be speaking against that thing.
the question is why these people can't see themselves as whole persons. i think maybe there's the possibility that deep inside or so they know that what they do is wrong, but they can't admit it, not even to themselves...
the idea here is mental imprisonment and how they subscribed to it in the way that they are so much in a tunnelvision state with their minds, that the conditioned mind dictates their perception of what is real and what is not and this leads to
the inability of not even being able to imagine alternatives anymore.
i dunno lol... i think it's like they can't breathe in some sense or so lol... too much pressure. :o :shock: :shock: :shock:
peace
KingLordMaster
Elfe Mécanique
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- 4 Mar 2012
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- 256
Loans = Electrical values, numbers called 'credit' typed into computer systems, at the bank or within the bank's systems.
Interest = That money loaned to you out of thin air, you must pay interest on it. That means paying more money back, money that was never physically there in the first place.
Paper money has been abused, I'm not saying it could never work. But it has lost its value, and more people are losing faith in paper money.
If I were you, I would always have a good 'emergency' supply of food, batteries, flash lights, camping gear, electrical and manual devices, and all the lot. Food and water being the most important. Just my 2 cents.
Interest = That money loaned to you out of thin air, you must pay interest on it. That means paying more money back, money that was never physically there in the first place.
Paper money has been abused, I'm not saying it could never work. But it has lost its value, and more people are losing faith in paper money.
If I were you, I would always have a good 'emergency' supply of food, batteries, flash lights, camping gear, electrical and manual devices, and all the lot. Food and water being the most important. Just my 2 cents.
ararat
Holofractale de l'hypervérité
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- 8 Juin 2006
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- 3 374
as long as we live in a debt/interest-based money system, we can change all we want, it still will be in our "rational" interest (within the confines of the present economic system, not universally/in life generally!) to be selfish, to exploit people and the planet, or just toil in industry. I agree that we need to change, and our changing will be the spawning ground for the change in the money system, but if the money system never changes, nothing will change.
how to change it.. I don't know, I wish I did. I can only hope that the economists will begin to see the fundamental problem in the money system and start to find new ways (such as negative interest money, to cite only one of many alternatives). but then again it is somewhat naive to wait for other to change :lol: I've been thinking a lot what to do with my life, and I think I shall commit myself to finding ways to decentralize food production and make permaculture practices available to a lot of people, I am convinced that this is a very powerful solution to at least part of the problem. people plant thujas and firs in their gardens and then go to the store to buy apples and berries, it's insane.
anyway, whenever I think about problems in the world, and I wonder why they are there, it boils down to money most of the time. I wouldn't be so fast to say that capitalism is mainly a psychological problem, the problem is systemic, because it makes it rational to act in ways that are against community, spirit, nature and ultimately oneself. the psychological problem comes after that. humans tend to try to live in accordance to whatever scheme they live in, hunter gatherer or banker, and one of the most fundamental things that need to happen in this world is to change the scheme so that it is (AGAIN) rational to be freely giving, to support community, to make new connections, to take care of the earth etc.
this is not to say that all problems will vanish, but it will make it a shit ton easier to do something about them. all these attempts to save the so-called environment are somewhat futile (if noble, though), because if capitalism runs out of fuel (natural, social, spiritual and cultural capital that is being sold out and monetized, hence the talk of "opening new markets") it will find new things to devour. I'm secretly hoping that it will run out of fuel so that it can finally break down, but I am afraid that it could easily continue for another 100 years like that. what is certain, though, is that it will break down, the moment it was created its demise was sealed. I'm just hoping it will be sooner rather than later.. meanwhile we can work on solutions, create gift-circles, exchange-places, free parties, learn about gardening/permaculture, just generally learning how to emancipate yourself economically, as an individual and a community.
how to change it.. I don't know, I wish I did. I can only hope that the economists will begin to see the fundamental problem in the money system and start to find new ways (such as negative interest money, to cite only one of many alternatives). but then again it is somewhat naive to wait for other to change :lol: I've been thinking a lot what to do with my life, and I think I shall commit myself to finding ways to decentralize food production and make permaculture practices available to a lot of people, I am convinced that this is a very powerful solution to at least part of the problem. people plant thujas and firs in their gardens and then go to the store to buy apples and berries, it's insane.
anyway, whenever I think about problems in the world, and I wonder why they are there, it boils down to money most of the time. I wouldn't be so fast to say that capitalism is mainly a psychological problem, the problem is systemic, because it makes it rational to act in ways that are against community, spirit, nature and ultimately oneself. the psychological problem comes after that. humans tend to try to live in accordance to whatever scheme they live in, hunter gatherer or banker, and one of the most fundamental things that need to happen in this world is to change the scheme so that it is (AGAIN) rational to be freely giving, to support community, to make new connections, to take care of the earth etc.
this is not to say that all problems will vanish, but it will make it a shit ton easier to do something about them. all these attempts to save the so-called environment are somewhat futile (if noble, though), because if capitalism runs out of fuel (natural, social, spiritual and cultural capital that is being sold out and monetized, hence the talk of "opening new markets") it will find new things to devour. I'm secretly hoping that it will run out of fuel so that it can finally break down, but I am afraid that it could easily continue for another 100 years like that. what is certain, though, is that it will break down, the moment it was created its demise was sealed. I'm just hoping it will be sooner rather than later.. meanwhile we can work on solutions, create gift-circles, exchange-places, free parties, learn about gardening/permaculture, just generally learning how to emancipate yourself economically, as an individual and a community.
you say you don't know how to change it... yet thats^ how! first awareness of an alternative must be brought to the attention of many. after that small scale practices snowball until it consumes us. systems like this grow exponentially. creating a community, even a few people who do business this way is a huge leap in getting this train rolling, and soon it will be unstoppable.
give-in
Matrice périnatale
- Inscrit
- 16 Mai 2012
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- 12
If you don't like money so bad then perhaps you need to go live in a rainforest I believe there are a few left. All this place does is complain about everything and everyone. After reading what sticki wrote I realized u just have to hope and wait for a lot of people to grow up.
Like talking to brick walls why waste u time.
Like talking to brick walls why waste u time.
BrainEater
Banni
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- 21 Juil 2007
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- 5 922
hmm why do you think that we shouldn't complain if it sucks?? would i be better if i simply accepted it even if i didn't like it??? i don't want to say that money in general has to be a bad idea, but the system as it is now and as it has been for me isn't very optimal to put it simple. it's too primitive in an animal like way. maybe you have seen the movie or know the book "animal farm" and then you will maybe understand better. and i do know that it doesn't make sense to talk to brick walls, however maybe if more people were able to use their own brains instead of following the retarded programs maybe then it could be a lot better already? instead of talking to the walls better destroy them.
and moving to a rainforest?? do you really think that's an alternative?? would i be able to survive??
do you know how many nasty people are there? i think maybe it's a more fundamental problem than you are willing to understand.
peace
and moving to a rainforest?? do you really think that's an alternative?? would i be able to survive??
do you know how many nasty people are there? i think maybe it's a more fundamental problem than you are willing to understand.
peace
give-in a dit:
the only way to correct a problem is to first recognize it as a problem. living in a rainforest? why don't you bring something real to the debate? is escapism your idea of problem solving? nobody should have to abandon society. there is no reason why society should not evolve, and talking about it is how to direct the nature of that change. is there a problem with that?
BrainEater
Banni
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no problem...easy lol... well actually i do feel a bit stuck in the ranting mode or so, but i can also recognize why it possibly is like that and that's because i feel in some way it's all becoming more and more meaningless, how it's so much only about money, stupid numbers and shit like that... so i didn't want to project anything on you, i just feel very angry and also sad...
peace
peace
don't be sorry, why should you be sorry? stand up for your self! step up and speak your mind! criticize what you consume. don't be beaten into not expressing yourself, that is what any industry-minded individual would love, apathy. clearly you mustn't agree with what's going on either, as you noted with the dwindling rainforests. all i'm asking is that you bring something to the debate instead of saying it's not worth talking about. if this isn't, then what is?
we can't all agree or else we would never have any new ideas. this is how change happens, a whole lot of ideas all get smashed together and then eventually we find ways that they fit together nicely, and something interesting and beautiful begins to emerge.
we can't all agree or else we would never have any new ideas. this is how change happens, a whole lot of ideas all get smashed together and then eventually we find ways that they fit together nicely, and something interesting and beautiful begins to emerge.
BrainEater
Banni
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- 21 Juil 2007
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- 5 922
yeah man!!! i just think the money system creates inhumane ways and have seen that in many forms. it's like people are pushed a lot into being mean, selfish and ego-driven. however it shouldn't be about that, because as i see it, development into such directions or so is bad for everyone.
how people that have a lot of shit have to pretend that they are happy and are not satisfied with what they have etc etc... so the problem is also a bit deeper... and in addition to that the war of the system that is there on so many levels... the bastards just try to disguise that a lot etc etc...a lot of stupid pretending and lying going on...
i also think it's a bit like give-in said that it seems as if we needed to wait for some people to grow up.
but if the lives of so many people depend so much on the ignorance of a few, then it's probably clearly time to do a revolution. i have experienced the exagerated focus on ego in myself, too and it's just not nice... but as i said i have the impression that it's as if we are pushed by the system to think unhealthily like that or so also... i just can't take how it often seems that it is so much more becoming meaningless in so many ways etc etc...
we can also see the degenerated ways that authority displays and we can probably do something, but only if we as a population unite and like opiuchus said not let us force anymore into their ignorance...
if you ask me, it's simply the insanity of economy and politics that is ruining us and the planet a lot. they rather focus and stick to stupid superficial shit instead of seeing the big picture or so... in some way i agree with the phrase "capitalism is the crisis", because it reduces the people to machines, maybe because they think they have to be like the system a machine.. but the system is so unevolved and seems to lead to strange and dangerous tendencies like communism-fascism or so. basically limited thinking... and it's also becoming more obvious how the system tries to impose that.
i feel it's a bit like the matrix... how slaves of the system and different manifestations of the system want to steal our freedom and also our souls...!!! i say let's simply not buy the stupid shit anymore.
maybe if more people tried to find their own ways instead of only being copies, stuck in the fear control and survival mode tunnelvision etc etc... then things could change... if we only could imagine it!!!!
peace
how people that have a lot of shit have to pretend that they are happy and are not satisfied with what they have etc etc... so the problem is also a bit deeper... and in addition to that the war of the system that is there on so many levels... the bastards just try to disguise that a lot etc etc...a lot of stupid pretending and lying going on...
i also think it's a bit like give-in said that it seems as if we needed to wait for some people to grow up.
but if the lives of so many people depend so much on the ignorance of a few, then it's probably clearly time to do a revolution. i have experienced the exagerated focus on ego in myself, too and it's just not nice... but as i said i have the impression that it's as if we are pushed by the system to think unhealthily like that or so also... i just can't take how it often seems that it is so much more becoming meaningless in so many ways etc etc...
we can also see the degenerated ways that authority displays and we can probably do something, but only if we as a population unite and like opiuchus said not let us force anymore into their ignorance...
if you ask me, it's simply the insanity of economy and politics that is ruining us and the planet a lot. they rather focus and stick to stupid superficial shit instead of seeing the big picture or so... in some way i agree with the phrase "capitalism is the crisis", because it reduces the people to machines, maybe because they think they have to be like the system a machine.. but the system is so unevolved and seems to lead to strange and dangerous tendencies like communism-fascism or so. basically limited thinking... and it's also becoming more obvious how the system tries to impose that.
i feel it's a bit like the matrix... how slaves of the system and different manifestations of the system want to steal our freedom and also our souls...!!! i say let's simply not buy the stupid shit anymore.
maybe if more people tried to find their own ways instead of only being copies, stuck in the fear control and survival mode tunnelvision etc etc... then things could change... if we only could imagine it!!!!
peace
DIY!!
that may not have been what you meant by "let's simply not buy the stupid shit anymore" but i think that even something as simple as fixing something yourself instead of bringing it to a shop to be fixed or buying another one goes a long way in taking the power out of their hands and putting it back in ours. repurposing old objects is another great way.
some basic ideas for starts
Most Popular Repurposing Tricks of 2011
that may not have been what you meant by "let's simply not buy the stupid shit anymore" but i think that even something as simple as fixing something yourself instead of bringing it to a shop to be fixed or buying another one goes a long way in taking the power out of their hands and putting it back in ours. repurposing old objects is another great way.
some basic ideas for starts
Most Popular Repurposing Tricks of 2011
BrainEater
Banni
- Inscrit
- 21 Juil 2007
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- 5 922
when i said "let's simply not buy their shit anymore" i was probably referring to the inhumaneness and the limitations of mental paradigms and mentality that comes with it... i dunno i often feel when i talk to people it seems as if they start to develop a philosophy or ideology related to money... or even something like a "feel-good story" for themselves or strange shit like that... in that sense i feel it's just so retarded like kindergarden...
i mean the money system can also be mental slavery... hmm and i have had the impression that some people are stuck in the calculator mode or something like that for most of the time lol...
maybe you also want to check out the movie "they live" which is about exactly that... how the people
become slaves or agents of the system and how violent and very strange the distinction between system and not-system can be...
because in the end the only motivation mostly seems to be fear and that's the point when i have to ask myself why all that shit??
what are the consequences of making people to programs or machines or so.. => the matrix
peace
i mean the money system can also be mental slavery... hmm and i have had the impression that some people are stuck in the calculator mode or something like that for most of the time lol...
maybe you also want to check out the movie "they live" which is about exactly that... how the people
become slaves or agents of the system and how violent and very strange the distinction between system and not-system can be...
because in the end the only motivation mostly seems to be fear and that's the point when i have to ask myself why all that shit??
what are the consequences of making people to programs or machines or so.. => the matrix
peace
oko
Glandeuse pinéale
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- 13 Juin 2012
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- 114
hey braineater, i would be very interested in the movie you talked about, "they live". Do you have a link to it? I'd like to watch it online. Since I live in europe, it'd be quite difficult to find it on dvd if it's a north american movie...
BrainEater
Banni
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- 21 Juil 2007
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Mrjelly
Glandeuse pinéale
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- 25 Août 2012
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- 232
It is a great notion to set out on your own without money but without it you cant possibly have the things that we take for granted. Money is necessary to have society. You cannot build the computer you are using to post this message, and the world wide web, and the power grid to support it all, not by yourself. You will also find it very hard to have everyone show up for work if they do not get something in return. They tried that I think it was called communism.
The U.S. was the best chance the planet had, unfortunately their are people who are destroying it. Socialism wont work either because you don't have enough motivating factors to keep people moving. you will end up with class warfare. You will have the people who want to do very little for their money and a dwindling amount of actual tax payers who foot the bill.
If you want to solve the problems in America don't vote for either of the two choices. At this point I don't think that Obama is even an option. He has shown us that he is just like every other lier that held office, if not worse!
The U.S. was the best chance the planet had, unfortunately their are people who are destroying it. Socialism wont work either because you don't have enough motivating factors to keep people moving. you will end up with class warfare. You will have the people who want to do very little for their money and a dwindling amount of actual tax payers who foot the bill.
If you want to solve the problems in America don't vote for either of the two choices. At this point I don't think that Obama is even an option. He has shown us that he is just like every other lier that held office, if not worse!