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.R.I.P. Bastiaan

HermesTrismegistus

Elfe Mécanique
Inscrit
11 Mai 2010
Messages
344
I`m not sure if i had to share this story here, but i need to get rid of some thoughts to find peace with some bad news that i heard yesterday.

This is a long story that started years ago, my username was in those days Mysticwarrior. Maybe some do remember still remember me.
In those days i learned to know a friend, who's name was Bastiaan and he was a member of psychonaut. He lived very near to where i lived in the netherlands, so on a random day we decided to meet each other. We had the same interests, psychdelics, philosophy, conpiracy etc, so we had endless conversation about this subject and it didn't took long before we where really good friends.

Not long after i learned to know him better and better, we had some conversation when we drove in my car. Then all suddenly he started to say things that shocked me in a certain way. He was fascinated by conspiracy theory's, and told me that he was a afraid that any secret government forces where about to kill him because he would have known to much. I remember when i heared this thought, i was like WTF, no way man. It concerned me, he seemed to start losing him self conspiracy theory's. Altough i heard him speaking about all those theory's, i where almost always to skeptical about them.

In the period that followed all kinds of things started to fall apart in his life. He's mind was so focussed on these conspiracy's, that even his parents became a part of them. He told me they where narcists, and that they would try control his life forever. He where always talking about freeing his self from this control his parents seemed to have on him. He was pretty smart and clever, so i told him because he was already 18 years old, it would be better to move out house. Which he eventually did. He rented a room somewhere near his parets. And of course(that's what a lot parents do) they keept caring for him, which he felt as if they where a part of conspiracy.

I where a squatter in those days, and since i had a lot of experience in claiming the rights to live in empty house/building, which was legal in those days. I found a nice empty farm house a lot of miles away from his parents. Although i was worried a bit to much, because he would live there all alone and would have no one to talk to, but he was convinced it was the perfect spot for him to be. So after a lot of talks, we decided to squat the building. The break in is illegal, but as soon when you're in and replaced the lock, you have the right to claim a building when it was unused for more then a year.

We decided to enter the building at night, we broke in quite easily and replaced the lock. I noticed that bastiaan had a way to much tensions, i had squated houses with many other people before, but he seemed be the far most tensioned person i had ever seen before, during the squatting of a building. That night i saw a fear in his eyes what never had gone away.

It was during the time he lived there when he started to completely lose him self. Instead of the parent control conspiracy things became less, it started to become even worse. He made a plan to leave everything behind him and imigrate to another country so no one would find him. In the beginning i thought, well i had these thoughts to when i where still around the age of 18. So i never thougth anything crazy about it, untill he kept talking about it everytime i spoke him. I'll noticed how serious he was about it, and tried to tell him that maybe he interpreted somethings in the wrong way. And that if he would continue his plans he would probably would heart a lot of people, which seems to be awfull punishment for his parents and his familly. In my eyes, his parents where just worried about him, so they felt forced to help bastiaan which he couldn't admire.

Everytime i visited him during the time he lived there in that farm house, things became more and more strange. One day when i was visiting him, he told me to go outside with him, he walked into very small forrest behind his farmhouse. Then he pointed his finger on the ground, where i noticed there where two little weed plants growing which where about 15-20cm tall. I told him this was not really good place for them, they would never get light under the trees. Then we heard the sound of a helicopter, and all suddenly he looked as if he had seen a ghost. He pointed at it, and told me he was afraid they where flying there because he had hidden those two plants(no reason to do, since having plant outside your home is legal). I noticed that he became totally irrational and way to paranoia. Sometimes when i visited him on unexpected moment he turned into panic attack, and had a struggle to breath. I'll just ringed the bell, like any other visitor would do. He lived in constant fear of his own psychotic thoughts which where far from rational. He kept moaning about his parents, and i did anything i could to keep helping relativate his thoughts. He told me he was depressed, and since i noticed seen seeing his personality falling apart, i told him he maybe could use some serious mental help and visit a psychologist, which he eventually did. But after one visit, he came back and told me they where a part of the plot. I think the psychologist must have been worried because they tried to visit him at home, because he didn't response to any phonecalls or letters. I always tried to help him in any way i could, i always tried to invite him to look different to the situation he was in.

And trust me, he was very intelligent, maybe sometimes to. To me it was obivious he was in a sort of psychosis. He also used lots of psychedelic substances during that time/period. Money was big trouble for him and he wasn't able to do a fulltime job, he just couldn't handle it. So he started to investigate how he could extract dmt and even made debts to create it. He made kilo's of it, but wasn't really able to sell it. Then on day i where at his home, and he told me he had planted weed in his home under lights(which is illegal...) he had like 70-100 plants all packed together. I where like wtf are you doing man, i told him it was weird because before he was afraid of two plants hided in the forrest. The weed was fully grown, so i said to go harvest them and get rid of them, and to not grow plants again. I was worried, because he was already paranoid.

That week the cops came at his home, they wanted to talk to him because he lived squated building, still its weird they did this at all. When bastiaan opened the door, the cop asked him what he smelled. They probably had smelled the air of the weed, which no one could ignore, because it was that obivous. He told the cops he wasn't in the mood for a talk and closed the door. That night he wanted to drop a friend of him at home, when he just left his street he got stopped by the cops and got arrested.

Then on a day, he started to talk about narcisme and altough he didn't say it straight away, he was obivously trying to tell me that i was a narcist to, because i influenced him. From that moment i started losing him, i think he started to think i where a part of his conspiracy to. On the last days i really spoke to him, he looked like a living dead person. He couldn't look people into the eyes, and where moaning about all kind of weird thoughts. Eventually i'll lost him, Then one year later i recieved some spam that seemed to sended from his mail adres. I wrote him a email about it, to try to get in contact with him because i where wondering how everything was doing with him. Then i got a answer from his mom and dad. They told me he was already gone for a year. They knew he was alive, but they couldn't figure out where he was. I told them the full story, about what happend and the thoughts bastiaan had about them and the world.

I tried to help them. I knew he was another country but had no clue where. His parents had recieved two emails with irrational thoughts which where sended from different email adresses i tried to send email to those adresses but never recieved a reply. I think he just created those adresses for one time. I found some signs of life on the internet, but where unable to track them. It seemed he wiped out all tracks of where he could live. Exactly as he had planned to do.

Then a year later, i got a call from his little brother, if i wanted to meet him because something terrible had happen to bastiaan. I came directly, and then his brother started to burst in tears and told me that bastiaan had commited suicide, and that the police in canada had found him after he was already dead for 3 days. I where shocked, and to be honest i feel terrible. Although i hope he found the rest and peace which he was so desperatly longing for to find.

Long story, but since he was a member of psychonaut, i felt it would be a good things to share it with you, as way to process everything i just heard.

I wish him all the love in the world, and honestly hope he is at peace now with himself and that he has found want he was looking for.

Goodbye bastiaan i will miss you bigtime!!!

Greets,
Hermes
 

schtroumpfette

Psycho disparu·e
Inscrit
11 Juin 2007
Messages
6 100
Wow... Don't know what to say :(
Sorry, man.
 

piou piou

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
7 Fev 2012
Messages
1 309
I randomly read this thread, and do not know neither you nor him. But i really feel sorry for your friend who lived in pain. I think you gave him as much care as you could, and I am pretty sure you did what you could.
It´s scary seeing how much a psychosis can destroy someone's life. What's the right thing to do when you meet someone like him ? To drive him to the hospital and let him live under medication for a while ? I don't know.

Sorry. Really.
 

HermesTrismegistus

Elfe Mécanique
Inscrit
11 Mai 2010
Messages
344
piou piou a dit:
I randomly read this thread, and do not know neither you nor him. But i really feel sorry for your friend who lived in pain. I think you gave him as much care as you could, and I am pretty sure you did what you could.
It´s scary seeing how much a psychosis can destroy someone's life. What's the right thing to do when you meet someone like him ? To drive him to the hospital and let him live under medication for a while ? I don't know.

Sorry. Really.

Its really scarry to see someone in such a state of mind, if there is at that time, any working mind at all.

I don;t think the hospital would be a solution for anyone in such a state of beeing. I think Bastiaan was just a another victim of a society that asks a way to much off ppl, which made him insane in the first place.

Don't know what to think right now, it still feels unreal and very sad....
 

ararat

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
8 Juin 2006
Messages
3 374
wow, he didn't seem so psychotic as a poster, nothing that I remember anywhay. sorry to hear the story.
 

BrainEater

Banni
Inscrit
21 Juil 2007
Messages
5 922
man, i really can't believe this... :(


peace
 

Puma

Matrice périnatale
Inscrit
6 Jan 2013
Messages
12
Sorry to hear that, even though I'm quite new here and didn't know either of you. It's sad how something can consume a person so much that it gets too much to bare.
 

GOD

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
14 Jan 2006
Messages
14 944
@ Mystic --- >

He was a nice guy but after a few months here it was obvious that he was mentaly confused .

BUT ...... so are a lot of people here now and so were a hell of a lot of the people that used to hang around here untill caduceus and his friends killed this site . Dont you remember all the arguments because people were recomending others to try to solve their problems with drugs ? Remember Vlad ? IF he realy existed and the storys about his suicide are true he was driven to death by people here and maybe on other sites talking shit ....... by people who think that they are psychonauts and drug experts but arent ......... by unqualifyed people trying to " help " him .

I know how you feel ....... something similar happened to me and my friend ingo killed himself .

@ The thread --- >

We move in a world where there are very very many unstable people . People takeing drugs that should not be takeing drugs = THE MOST PEOPLE . Drugs are definately not for all people and drugs dont solve problems .

WE should not be trying to play doctor . When we see someone with obvious problems we should tell them and / or their relations and / or get advice from a doctor on what to do .

Untill we do that = start to be responsible people drugs will never be " legalised " .

I think that everyone here should take a pause and think about what we are doing and why and what the consequencies can be . Drugs are not toys and the mind is a very delicate thing .

ALL of you need to go out and do some reserch ...... real research not looking at sites like this and think that people here are experts in anything . There are no drug experts here . Erowid is a good place to start . Reading books by internationaly know and respected writers is a good idea to ..... BUT ..... be carefull . There are very very many sharlatans and mentaly ill people out there pretending that they are experts and that they know things = by far the most people in this scene . Learn your limits . Learn to take responsibility for yourselves and the people around you . If you see problems say something .
 

HermesTrismegistus

Elfe Mécanique
Inscrit
11 Mai 2010
Messages
344
Hi God,

I`m a bit of surprised to see you're active again, but in a good way ;) Ah man, i remember those days very very well. And altough i couldn't handle you're direct way of putting things in words, i'll now do believe you where so right about a lot of things. And i also realise how important you're place was here on psychonaut. And how we destroyed the forum, but maybe this all just needed to happen. You where one of the view who had the guts and the experience, and tried to show people the other side that they didn't wanted to see. It took me ages to understand what you always tried to say to caduceus and many others, me included. But unless all the crap fights we had, you words where afterall not invane!

BUT ...... so are a lot of people here now and so were a hell of a lot of the people that used to hang around here untill caduceus and his friends killed this site . Dont you remember all the arguments because people were recomending others to try to solve their problems with drugs ? Remember Vlad ? IF he realy existed and the storys about his suicide are true he was driven to death by people here and maybe on other sites talking shit ....... by people who think that they are psychonauts and drug experts but arent ......... by unqualifyed people trying to " help " him .

Psychedelics are definatly not toys! In some occasions it can help people(if it stays by very rarely occasional experience), in other occasion(especially when it psychedelics become an obsession) it can aswell destroy someone's personality.... But i guess, that's something one only realise when the train stops and one can no longer ignore what mess he created. And altough i believed what you said about vlad, my ego and those of others just refused to see what really happened. Maybe it was just the obsession and our own healing experiences that caused some form of tunnelvision.

I know how you feel ....... something similar happened to me and my friend ingo killed himself .


It feels like like shit, really shit. Today i wen't to the remembrance ceremony of bastiaan to say him farewell. Man i've been crying almost all the time, and realised if i`m really honest to myself, how i can not think of any other reason, then that his obsession for psychedelics as well as amphetamines, must have been the reason why he lost all sanity and starting to believe in a gigantic illusion which made him feel that his life was pointless. They showed a lot of pictures in from young, till pictures just a view month's before he did run away and left everything behind him in hope to find a new place to live in peace with himself, which obviously didn't work out that way. Especially on the pictures where he was around 18 years(and started with psychedelics and amphetamines) i could just see the pain in his eyes. He must have felt himself so lost in this world..

We move in a world where there are very very many unstable people . People takeing drugs that should not be takeing drugs = THE MOST PEOPLE . Drugs are definately not for all people and drugs dont solve problems .


Altough psychedelics can make someone mind wonder about the deeper layers of life and maybe can give people hope(if its not fails hope) i agree for 100% they don't solve any problem at all.

ALL of you need to go out and do some reserch ...... real research not looking at sites like this and think that people here are experts in anything . There are no drug experts here . Erowid is a good place to start . Reading books by internationaly know and respected writers is a good idea to ..... BUT ..... be carefull . There are very very many sharlatans and mentaly ill people out there pretending that they are experts and that they know things = by far the most people in this scene . Learn your limits . Learn to take responsibility for yourselves and the people around you . If you see problems say something .
The most ppl just do have big ego's that want to be experts(i was surely one of them), well in fact without realising they point people right in the direction to self destruction. Especially the last sentence is of uttermost importance: Learn your limits! Learn to take responsibility for yourselves and the people around you! And keep connected to the world around you, if you're to confused be able to function properly inside society, then its about time to look in the mirror and pull on the brakes of the train!

I've known already 3 ppl, who lost them selves completely because of heavy usage of psychedelics and mainly LSD, and altough i don't have the expertice to what the real reasons where, but for all three people LSD was totally the thing. One of the guys i've seen go nuts, wen't also into severall heavy psychotic episode, one of those psychotic episodes was so heavy that he ended up in a hospital for more then a year. He couldn't even talk properly and lost all self control and awareness.

I know many of you will think, this doesn't happen to me. But if 3 out of 10 people i knew have gone nuts, and one even killed himself. That's for me the proof that chances are huge, that you shouldn't be surprised if IT does happen to you...!

I'm definately don't condemn drugs, or are against them. But i've learned truth from my own stupidity, and many of you(if you have that luck) will do the same, soon or later! ;)
So GOD, thanx for sharing all the knowledge and experience you had!! (Even tough it seemed we didn't listen to you...)

Greets,
Mysticwarrio!!
 

ararat

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
8 Juin 2006
Messages
3 374
the thing with psychedelics is that many people often seem to think that they have found "the truth" and act with a confidence that mirrors that thought. I read on realitysandwich an article the other day and it said that the author feels that many in the psychedelia scene often seem to be act within religious delusion - and I agree. it is way to easy to trip out and feel that one has seen the truth.

what I still think, though, is that psychedelics can act as a powerful inspirational device - that's what it was for me. to see what is possible, that reality is SO much more, but then to go and realize that potential without psychedelics. certainly I haven't heard of any person attaining enlightenment or whatever we are after just by taking copious amounts of LSD, to the contrary.
 

HermesTrismegistus

Elfe Mécanique
Inscrit
11 Mai 2010
Messages
344
I`m an astrologer, and i would suggest to read about mythology of neptune. Yes, it shows the innerworld and its an important force within someones personality. But neptune also has everything to do with delusions, frauds, self deceptions and its no wonder that Psychedelics belong to neptune's domain.

Neptune, God of the Sea, is the ruler of Pisces. In astrology, Neptune is considered a planet of inspiration, dreams, psychic receptivity, illusion, and confusion. Neptune rules spirituality, and all things subtle. A youthful, and sometimes naive, spirit characterizes those with a strong placement of Neptune in their natal charts.On the up side, Neptune is associated with intuition and spiritual enlightenment. As well, it is a planet of mercy and compassion. The more negative manifestations of Neptune include deception, trickery, deceit, guilt, and addiction. In the chart, the position of Neptune by sign will be shared with other people in the same generation due to Neptune's slow movement in the heavens. By house, Neptune's position shows where intuition, dreams, and psychic sensitivity come into play. Natives may be able to rise above the demands of the ego in the areas of Neptune's influence.Planets that Neptune contact are often colored by fantasy and dreaminess, and a vulnerable nature that may be susceptible to disillusionment. Here, we find hope that is sometimes unrealistic, a poetic and intuitive outlook, and compassion.
 

ararat

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
8 Juin 2006
Messages
3 374
I suppose neptune was in a major aspect in bastiaans chart? I gave astrology a chance some time ago, and I think there might be quite something to it. Richard Tarnas makes some amazing points comparing charts and historical occurences.
 

BrainEater

Banni
Inscrit
21 Juil 2007
Messages
5 922
personally, i can say i can understand how he maybe could have felt... however i am only speaking for myself when i say i have experienced for myself in my opinion way too many times how cruel "the world", no the "people", can be... :-|
seriously... what some people do emotionally, mentally, spiritually etc etc... just having to look at some people or even images or movies etc etc can make you sick ... if you ask me, society is still dealing with all the post war traumatic stress or so... not sure how to call that shit. :?
when other people violently on the mentionend levels want to tell your story for you.. it can really get on your nerves, you know???? :Oo: :roll:
maybe just one way of understanding the world without pretending and all the fake shit is to polarise the thought process or so with the idea that it's all conspiracy and there are no conspiracies. and possibly that is the first step and the second step. however i am not sure whether anyone understands it... if you ask me, as far as i can tell myself it's probably like in the movie "the matrix"... morpheus says somewhere: "i can't tell you what the matrix is, you have to see it for yourself."
if people want to understand how sick and insane the world really is beyond the surface, then i would say they have to at least try to understand how for example terrence mc kenna thought.
i think a very meaningful quote from him was: "what we need as a culture is an awakening."
all the compulsive happiness people etc etc... :paranoid: :( :\\
but then also think of the idea that it can frustrate or depress people if they can't communicate their happiness or their sadness. well but then again i would say this is still something natural...
or like how some people think how they think they understand how some things fit together or are connected... nevertheless how does it all "really" fit together??
sometimes people tell you they understand you, but they really don't and what if they don't even accept if you tell them they don't understand you? however still as i said i can only speak for myself... so yeah... i can honestly say sometimes i have had the feeling myself that it's all too much to bare... :crybaby:
i mean it's easy to say this, but it's a different story to really experience that...
my wish is also that his soul may find real peace.. i think he is a really noble soul. :heart:
maybe anyone has heard of the phrase "legalize spiritual discovery" and how exactly some societies or aspects of societies can make it hard for dreamers and psychonauts. if mental limitations or so can be matters of perspectives can it still be uncomfortable if other people don't stop pushing them on you? :roll: :puke: anyway, i guess i'm mostly on the side of the "real psychonauts" for sure.
what else? is astrology without humaneness like people without shadows?? who knows... :? :roll:
or are psychedelics without introspection like philosophy without "people"?
just some ideas... well, and i can say in my own experience it often made me sad how it seemed that machines tried to overtake the power... can't really explain it... astrology and philosophy should be noble quests!!!.... to me that's a fact.


@GOD i like what i guess i would like to call your quest for healthy common sense or so. the thing is why exactly and why not we should or should not believe when people tell us how they feel. the question is are they even able to communicate their real feelings and is that always their own fault??? it's not an easy topic..
also sometimes labelling someone as mentally confused can be abused as discrediting what that person is saying. you know? i guess in such a case it's really the big picture what it's about.
@ararat although i guess i agree with a part of your argument i am not sure whether it's always good to generalise it absolutely like that... what if it's still different for everyone? for some it works like this or that but for others differently. then i guess for some strange reason or so i think it could be it's at least a possibility that some people only "can" "see" "the truth", when they trip out... "you know?" please think about it just a little bit. just don't get me wrong...
furthermore i think taking psychedelics is possibly a bit a different thing than sober meditations or so... think of the plant spirits of nature.. it's a different way of connecting to the spirits of nature or going beyond ego, mind and reality, if you take psychedelics...
@hermes please don't get me wrong!!... but how can you say for sure that there weren't any conspiracies or shit like that...?? i mean like what if the secret government did actually kill him like that...??? ever thought of it that way? mind control can be a nasty thing and that's even probably an understatement. also, as what did you concsciously or not consciously think or not think to have labeled or not labeled him as? "get the point"? the thing is, we as humans, logically, can't comprehend or look through the plan of god. :roll:
actualy, although i didn't really know him, to be honest i find it a bit rude to say he was just a lunatic... or just another victim of society...
where is the humaness going... yeah i know we're all just numbers etc etc...
right.... :roll: :roll: :roll: man!!! :crybaby: :x




peace
 

Finarfin

Sale drogué·e
Inscrit
20 Juil 2013
Messages
798
I am an old psychonaut member myself and i used to post under the username Magickmumu.
I remeber Bastiaan from here. I once visited hermes (mysticwarrior) at his house, he told me about Bastiaan and the farm house where he lived.
It is sad to read this. I wonder how he ended up in Canada. it is horrible for his parents and the rest of his family.


@ God
Good to see you,re back. And posting unsubtle and without nuance :) like we know you.
I agree with a lot that you say. However i think you are not very subtle and it lacks nuance.
i think it is not good to recommend people to solve there problems with drugs and i DO NOT remember anyone recommending this. On the contrary most people here have given warnings against taking drugs or doing psychedelics when having psychological problems.
Also you talk about caduceus and his friends. I have known caduceus and i do not consider myself a friend of him. I know that caduceus when i met hem did not have (m)any (real) friends. He once told me he had no time to have friends. I have visited Caduceus a couple of times, just like i visited hermes (mystic) and we did have psychonaut meetings at his place. He was friendly and we had a good time, but i would not consider him a (real) friend. Eventually he got obsessed by this armagadon conspiracy illuminati website and he started to become very religious about it. He wanted to join the illuminati working for them helping to build there one party dictatorship new world order. He started to call people who did not agree with him ignorant. And he tarted to use more and more logical fallacies to promote this illuminati nonsense. So in the end when i did not agree with his believes he was not that friendly anymore. However before he went obsessive with this illuminati stuff, he did some good work. I think he was not all bad. I think he has his weak spot, like all of us. His ego (thinking of himself as a guru sometimes or of himself of being more special spiritual then others) and his obsessive character. His ability to become a true believer which leads to tunnel vision.

Anyway back on topic: People are ultimately responsible for themselves. When we see someone who is in pain who is sick or who is psychotic all we can do is try to help them the best we can. And it is hard to help someone who thinks everybody is against them and who does not want help. I say this because i know this from experience in my private as well as professional life. I also have known people who where psychotic or who committed suicide. however not all of them used drugs or psychedelics. as a matter of fact most of them did not use psychedelics or drugs.
It is always sad to see people destroying themselves. there are all sorts of self destructive behavior. one can use drugs like amphetamines or alcohol or psychedelics it does not really matter. It is not the substance, it is the behavior that is destructive. The substance is only a tool for the destruction of the self. I have seen a lot of people use alcohol cocaine and amphetamines to destroy themselves.
What happened to Bastiaan is very sad indeed. I woiuld never recommend people to use psychedelics as a cure for psychosis. Psychedelics i think only can make things worse. However for me personally psychedelics are not about destroying the self. Maybe psychedelics have the potential to be used to threat somethings like depression and addiction. However I think when used like that people should be very careful and it should be done by professionals within a safe environment. I did never and i would never recommend people to take care of there psychological or physiological problems by taking psychedelics and medicating them selfs. Always go to you doctor with your problems.
 
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