Human space/time migration and the new frontier ?

[IJesusChrist]

You're completely right mescaline, it is science - but I think the majority (and holy shit is it alot of people, even PhD people) forget that it's a theory - and forget that we have been wrong before.

It just seems like wow did people grab on to string theory fast.

And mumu, you're close... I mean in a philosiphic sense yes, it's atomism. But it's kind ...

It's very interesting to learn about. I'll give an example of quantization.

So a hydrogen atom can have infinitely many excited states theoretically.
But. That is not to say that a hydrogen atom can have ANY excited state.

That is, if you give an unexcited hydrogen atom lets say 1 unit of energy. Since it's states are quantized it will either become excited, in a new state, or it will have to reject the energy and stay in the same state.

So, lets give the example that a Hydrogen atom needs 8 units of energy to reach each new excited state.

That means that if you had any amount of energy less than 8 units of energy, nothing would happen. If you gave it 9 it would reach excited state "#1" but wouldn't use that extra unit of energy. 16 units - level "#2". 17 would be no different than 16.

SO. What this does is it makes atoms, which become molecules all quantized, that is that you can have a finite number of combinations of energy.

Which is truly, truly bizarre when you start to understand it.

 

[st.bot.32]

that's the reason we discovered particles like the electron in the first place.. because some things like the above.. or also related to the electron--electrical current is indeed quantized.

that's what i love about scientific discovery.. finding out that the universe doesn't run on human common sense. it just gets weirder and more awe inspiring the deeper you go.

 

[????????]

ah so they made 11 to fit all those wacky particles. it reminds me if this. i once read in a magazine (popular mechanics if i remember well) that there are these weird things called muons i think, that are travelling at insane speeds all over us at all times. the cover had this silhouette were you could put the palm of your hand on and it said how many of them would be going through it at any given moment. it was a ridiculously high number.

hey thanks for string theory 101. although yeah one can't help but think that they sort of went 'we can't divide stuff anymore so let's just make it all a big same thing'. the funny thing is that it correlates with the oneness experience we are all familiar with.

 

[Brugmansia]

The greatest obstacle of our future direction is to overcome our addiction to the practical feasibility of our technology and it's insertion of it's shrewd powerful AI's. This is a very long-term challenge but because we do not necessarily experience this process as perceptible change, our field of vision may not see the edge of the collapse to prevent the need for ultimate choas.

Required agents of Wisdom shall attempt to abolish the controller of the childish baby who's mathematical frame work has compressed each of us to a mortal in a frozen pond.

True Wise Men who do not fear when the bottom under their feet seems to swell upwards and later the incontrovertible conversion into liquid while being on fire, must carry their knowledge for those very few kids who're blessed with their unbounded wings of love, each side reaching up to the stars.

All in all, it depends on our commen sense whether we'll be in able to use our intelligence for the better or the worse. We'll never become the conqueror of the universe, but it doesn't stop us from trying, the ruler of the universe is the universe itself. As big as a Spa bubble really, imagine two of these bubbles coming together... mankinds spends it billions pretending to be an opponent.

 

[Space-is-the-Place]

Hey brug, when can we expect your first proze book? :mrgreen:

 

[IJesusChrist]

That video is very interesting... I see how they are imagining dimensions now...

Although I'm not sure... Its a very good idea I'm not sure if that is the correct answer, though, I had been taught that time is not of the same dimension type as space.

What I had learned is time is actually not a dimension, you cannot move in it, an in actuality (in my opinion) it doesn't technically exist. The dimensions over the 3rd dimension are in actuality simply just other spacial dimensions, with the ability move in and out. just like the video suggest - you can fold a dimension, and bypass one... this doesn't really make anysense to me, and I don't actually believe in >3 dimensions simply because it would make a hierarchy of dimensions.

Its a very fascinating idea but I don't believe in >3 dimensions, or that time itself is a dimension.

 

[Brugmansia]

I'm still too much in the middle of my own journey, harvesting the lianas within my current sight at this age would result in a delivered book work which partly still runs on petrol.

 

[BrainEater]

time is an illusion just like space is an illusion. it isn't really there. solid objects seem to be there but if you look closer it seems to be mostly emptyness between all the atoms and whatnot. i think our intellects mostly can't imagine the fourth dimension fully, because we can't step out of it. we are all the time moving in it because time always passes, so as a part of this movement we probably can't "overlook" it or "comprehend" it completely. i don't wanna say we can't, but these conditions
would probably make it more difficult.

 

[Space-is-the-Place]

I'm still too much in the middle of my own journey, harvesting the lianas within my current sight at this age would result in a delivered book work which partly still runs on petrol.

Haha, fair enough

 

[IJesusChrist]

According to the video, we are 3 dimensional beings, moving through the 4th dimension - so we can't actually grasp the 4th dimension unless we make ourselves of 4 dimensions - i.e. we don't age, we are our entire lifes at once (Kurt Vonnegut wrote about an alien race that does this in slaughterhouse5 - favorite book of mine). Then we could grasp the 5th dimensions.

Cool idea, very cool.

I also don't agree with you on the 3 dimensions - I believe they exist in a much greater sense than time.

I'll have to give this video more thought though.

 

[BrainEater]

maybe if time actually is the 4th dimension we would rather be 4 dimensional beings. but it might also be possible that we are moving through a bunch of other dimensions without being aware of it. i think the whole thing in which we are all "trapped" is called "space-time-continuum"...

and how can we not be our entire lives at once?? the separation takes only place in the mind. day-night, awake-asleep hour-day-week-month-year, young-old: all distinguished in the mind like different types of apples.

the idea of a multidimensional reality is by the way just a "model", used to describe reality mathematically and as accurate as possible in the microscale etc. when it comes to applying some of these models to actual reality it often can get a bit difficult because some ideas seem to be so far out and calculations you could make would be very complicated anyways...

superficially you could almost say all these concepts were wanted to be thought out by some intelligent people to satisfy their and maybe also others' wishes to know that there is an invisible "order" in the universe...

i don't know tho why order seems to be much more important than anything else for some people....

 

[magickmumu]

According to the video, we are 3 dimensional beings, moving through the 4th dimension - so we can't actually grasp the 4th dimension unless we make ourselves of 4 dimensions - i.e. we don't age, we are our entire lifes at once (Kurt Vonnegut wrote about an alien race that does this in slaughterhouse5 - favorite book of mine). Then we could grasp the 5th dimensions.

Cool idea, very cool.

I also don't agree with you on the 3 dimensions - I believe they exist in a much greater sense than time.

I'll have to give this video more thought though.

Slaughterhouse 5, nice book indeed and it's a interesting cool idea.
Those aliens would see music as objects.

 

[IJesusChrist]

unfortunately the flaws in my opinion of this theory constitute that there are other possibilities for everything.

My own thoughts are that there is no freewill, and deeper, there is no random. This is where my ultimate feeling of "time is an illusion" comes from, it really isn't necessary except, for somereason, in consciousness.

However - I would love to be surprised and be wrong, but as of right now, it still stands this way.

 

[magickmumu]

Albert Einstein said God does not play dice with the universe.
Just like you he refused to believe there was a random. That's why he resisted quantum mechanics.
He was more or less convinced there was a hidden variable. And that the universe needed to be deterministic.

 

[IJesusChrist]

I don't believe in random. If I don't believe in random, there is no time.
I kind of like that thought, although no emotion can really be expressed to that thought...
In the deepest part of my mind, which i give no credit to whatsoever I do believe the entire universe is composed of an operator, and an equation. Just 1, the operator being what most view as "God" and the equation being ... something else.

In the end, it's just a fractal.

 

[magickmumu]

a oparator and a equation :?:
Why do you believe these two components make up the universe.

I am not religious myself. When people start talking about god it gets me confused.
God as operator. I don't know IJC :?:

 

[IJesusChrist]

If you've read my other posts about how I view "god" you'd understand. I use that term only because its definition encompasses reality.

 

[ophiuchus]

"god" is the conscious aspect mumu. saying that god and anything are separate is impossible. everything is made of the exact same stuff(im not going to debate it's physical manifestation) that is energy, which is consequently dependent on space and time, making them all really the same thing when it comes down to it.
everyone's endowed with free thought, i believe there's free will in recognizing positivity and negativity, and also acting accordingly. nobody is stuck in any path that they do not want to be stuck in. or not so much that they want to be stuck in, but have lost enough care to even try to get out. depression and apathy is the real destroyer of worlds, not oppenheimer.
if you dont believe in random ijc, then i'd be curious to know what you think about non-repeating patterns, like data sheets like this?
http://help.eclipse.org/help33/topic/or ... h_view.jpg

note that if you look very basically, you clearly see: up, after down, after up, after down. a repeating pattern in that sense, a basic sense, which is: "up down ad nauseam". same thing is seen as well, if you zoomed in to a day to day scale, as if you were looking on a multi-year timeline. one year, general ascension, the other, descent. the one factor that throws everything on it's head though, which is simply undeniable, is the time-span in which this happens. that's why people lose money in the stock market. some years are more productive than others, and some dont change much at all. but there's always change. one thing you'll never see, is an "up down pattern" section of a graph that repeats itself perfectly the same as an earlier or later "up down pattern" section. you could never lay one section of a graph over another and them be perfectly the same. very similar yes, but... it's uncertainty, or inconsistency. but wait, how is it inconsistent if you know it's eventually going to come back up?

imperfect perfection, or *attempted perfection. it's not harmony, and yet it's not chaos, it's somewhere in between... the conscious aspect now manifests itself physically. :idea:

even though you can see the general direction something is heading, you can never precisely determine where it will be in a later point in time. just because time is an illusion, does not mean time doesn't exist. time is a fundamental, just like space, just like energy, or matter. this is an illusion, does it not exist?
http://www.mobile-pedia.com/images/thum ... inning.png

THERE IS NO "BLACK", NOR "WHITE". just an idea of so, with a brighter or darker shade of grey, in which you are given the self appointed task of labeling. im not saying anything contrary to your perception of time, really. only that it may be a little one sided. there's a duality to everything, and so nothing truely makes sense, unless you have faith in that grey area...

 

[IJesusChrist]

you don't understand random... in order to make that graph, you would either need an equation (which gives predictable outcomes) or you are measuring things.

Everything we can measure is based on physical laws that we can (or will be able to) describe, and are not random.

Unless you believe in Q.M. B.S.

 

[BrainEater]

god can't be explained scientifically. it's everything and nothing, but what has god to do with randomness?? or with non-randomness?? and can we even be sure the god is there or not there or whether it would just be an invention we made in our minds to describe the indescribable in order to be able to "nail it down" ???

peace :weedman: