Don't mess with Texas!

[JustinNed]

I heard this on the radio on my way home from work and tracked down an audio clip!
(11/15/07 - KTRK/PASADENA, TX) - A dramatic 911 call from the Pasadena man who allegedly shot and killed two men accused of burglarizing his neighbor has been released. The dispatcher tried to talk him out of it.

The audio can be heard here http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/story?secti ... id=5538780

 

[Djones]

Omg :shock: what an idiot guy that is!!!!


And on top of that, there's loads of crazy people there in the us, who even support his actions!!!!
How sick is that!???! :shock: :? :?:

 

[GOD]

Typical " brave " American , hide behind a wall of lead like the speed freaks high on amphetamines from blackwater and the US forces friendly fire murderers . The nazi bastard could have put a shot over their heads and if that didnt work one into their legs . But then again they were black and he is white .

 

[silv]

Typical " brave " American , hide behind a wall of lead like the speed freaks high on amphetamines from blackwater and the US forces friendly fire murderers . The nazi bastard could have put a shot over their heads and if that didnt work one into their legs . But then again they were black and he is white .

IF you're going to shoot you'd be a bloody idiot aiming at someones legs, shoot them in the chest because that's where you get the biggest target.
However, it goes wrong at the part where you're going to shoot someone. That's the real bullshit about it, shooting other people.

 

[GOD]

I totaly agree with you , i wasnt advocating anyone shooting anyone , i was being sarcastic . I meant it was premeditated murder , the guy said "I'm gonna kill 'em." before he went outside , and that hes getting away with it because they were black guys .

 

[toadlicker]

i personally think this guy is one of the great understated heros of texas. the two men that he shot where not only illegal aliens but they where also in a mexican gang involved in kidnapping young american girls to be sold to mexican drug lords.
he gave both men a chance to stop and return the stuff they had stolen, they declined this opertunatety. therefore they are completely at fault and the kind hearted gentleman who was only looking out for his neighbors well being and property should be given an award for bravery and not a jail sentence. besides how stupid do you have to be to think you can do something like rob someone in texas and not be shot for it. in the same situation i would do no different, though i'm not kind hearted enough to use a shotgun, for me it's 5.56 95 grain silver balistic tips, they can go through body armor at 300 yards with an entrance hole of about 1 centimeter and an exit hole the size of a small car. but i am a huge gun nut, not as bad as my wife but still pretty crazy about firearms.

 

[phalaris]

in the same situation i would do no different, though i'm not kind hearted enough to use a shotgun, for me it's 5.56 95 grain silver balistic tips, they can go through body armor at 300 yards with an entrance hole of about 1 centimeter and an exit hole the size of a small car. but i am a huge gun nut, not as bad as my wife but still pretty crazy about firearms.

Good for you.

What is your goal; satisfying your hatred towards thieves, or getting the thieves out your home, while prefebly leaving your stuff behind ?

I hate thieves too. And yes, they should not touch your stuff.

But DEATH is far too permanent for providing a solution.

Two month ago, the wallet (100 euros plus all her cards etc) of my girlfriend was stolen from her purse when she was at a friend's place, and we even had an idea who did it (coke addicted neighbour). My first reaction was that of fury and hatred, and I wanted to hurt the neighbour badly. Then, some hours later I only wanted to throw a brick through her window. Later on, we accepted that we would not see our stuff back, as we did not know for 100% sure who did it. Now I see her ( the neighbour) more as a victim than us; my GF and I went on with our lives while the thief still is slave to her addiction.

But perhaps a person with a little less self control, and ready acces to a gun would have acted on those first rushes of primitive instint in another way, especially when she would have been caught red handed.

And for what ? Two grams of mediocre quality coke.

besides how stupid do you have to be to think you can do something like rob someone in texas and not be shot for it

The severity of the consequences of an action does not significantly lower the threshold for an individual to undertake an action, if the individual feels he or she has no alternative.

In economic theory this is called 'inelasticity', and applies to goods such as gas, food and water.
As psychonauts we see as it the the continued use of drugs throughout the word, regardless of the local punishments differing in each country.

In simple terms: 'scaring off' punishments do not work.

So:

Technology is beautifull.
Gun technology is great.

Target shooting is also great fun, I've done that with a BB gun a great many times in my youth, and I would have loved shooting with a real rifle.

But mixing primitive emotions with powerfull technology (read: death spreading) is not a smart idea, humans cannot handle it.

Undoubtily this (mexican shooting) is one of those situation where 'you just had to be there' to truly understand it. But:

Death is never a solution. Period. No matter how you sugar coat it.

( I sense a big cultural difference regarding guns/death/violence between the Old Europe and the New United States )

 

[silv]

big wordup phalaris, really well said!

 

[toadlicker]

i still can't agree. especially in the situation with the wallet that was mentioned. the person is still a coke head. maybe going to retrieve the wallet would have been just what saved the person. there's also the chance that it was someone else that took the wallet, but i would put my money on an addicted person any day.
in my opinion there is nothing wrong with following primative insticts. they're what keeps us alive. even when in meditation you're primal self is making sure you're not in harms way. you can't move forward without going back to you're roots.
anyway the man followed texas law, he gave them fair warning. that's all that's required. the point is they were here illegally and had been caught before, they had been caught before for kidnapping girls to sell to mexican drug lords plus alot of other crimes. when they were arrested before they were only sent back to mexico not once were they punished for what they were doing. i can't be sympathetic for those two. to much emapthy and compassion without limit will crumble any world. they are just as dangerous as power and greed.

 

[GOD]

toadlicker . Where did you get your sick false information about the two guys , their criminal records and place of origin ? From a KKK web site ? All the press reports i have seen and all the internet press reports i can find dont say anything like what you have said . You are on the wrong forum here , this forum is for loving people , for psychonauts not mentaly ill nazi racist scum . FUCK OFF .

 

[toadlicker]

all i was doing was raising a different side of the conversation. the things that those two have done are all over the news here. i'm not saying kill them all. this is what pisses me off about you hippies, anytime some one has a different opinion they're automaticly a nazi. grow the fuck up! why would you make false claims about some one you really clearly don't know anything about. i never once said you were wrong about your opinion i just don't agree with it.
when you grow up enough to have a conversation i'll still be on psychonaut.
for some one that goes by GOD you'd think you'd be a bit open minded, understanding, or atleast not so insecure that you have to throw a 3 year olds temper tantrum when some one doesn't share your veiws.

 

[VerusDeus]

If god can't call you a nazi, then why can you call the rest of us hippie?

 

[toadlicker]

that was a very generalized statement, i apologize for making it. i don't want to include everyone in that statement.
i do apologize to everyone else. but not to GOD, though if GOD would enter into a rational dialog with me i may feel compelled to retract what was said.

 

[phalaris]

How ironic

This very thread illustrates how fast human interaction can unwind into chaos or calling names. The same thing happens when actual violence is involved, only on a far more serious scale.

My point in my earlier post was not that one should not acknowledge primitive urges, on the contrary; it is important to realize we have them. And sure, we have to take actions when needen againts injustice/theft etc.

In the case of the wallet: Perhaps there would have been a fight if I had caught her red handed, but most certainly nobody would have died that day. In a country with xx% gun ownership, that is not quite so sure.

My point was that we still have the same violent instincts as in a time when we did not have InstantDeath (tm) technology available.

It is just not smart to give 21st century guns to a mammal with a million years old brain in a situation of stress, panick and violence. If you really need to hurt or scare someone, take a baseball bat, or other less lethal weapon. Take the guns to a shooting range or a desert and have fun, but it has no place in a violent situation.

Compassion and empathy are only dangerous because of power and greed.

Killing is wrong, in whatever form. There is no way to be pragmatic about it.

 

[spice]

You should post more, phalaris.

Toadlicker- How do. I have to respond to the pro gun stance you espouse....I have no personal axe to grind with you, so don't take this personally, but us 'hippies' only came about because you gun nuts were shooting the whole world up without cease in the '60s.

Someone has to speak out against loving an inanimate object that only produces DEATH. It is an illness, in my opinion, to hold such esteem for such an ugly, useless item.

I am curious; did you get this love of guns and weaponry from your father/grandfather? This is where it usually comes from, and what makes it so dangerous is that we accept these ideas as gospel truth whilst we are still in our formative stages, and have developed no critical thinking skills to actually THINK about these hand-me down attitudes.

It's hard for me to understand how someone who professes to love guns can be sensitive to someone who is, in their words, 'intolerant'.


Owning a gun is the supreme expression of intolerance.

 

[phalaris]

It's hard for me to understand how someone who professes to love guns can be sensitive to someone who is, in their words, 'intolerant'.

Owning a gun is the supreme expression of intolerance

Well, I think we should separate the actual gun (the technology) as an object from the main purpose is was designed for (death).

The statement then becomes: Owning a gun with a readyness to kill is the supreme expression of intolerance.

Denying gun nuts their passion on the shooting range would be intolerant on the hippy part imo.

 

[spice]

Yes, but how does one actually acheive this ( separating the tech from the purpose the tech was created for) in the heat of the moment?

I tend to think in zen terms here, and I posit that you CANT do it, as the purpose and the object are, if not one and the same, then so close that the majority of people would be unable to do it.

As you yourself show, it is actually pretty easy to make these distinctions when you are calm and emotionally detatched, but our mammalian 'war machine' brains go to 'ignition' too fast for us to posess the ability to deliver instant erasure.

People like you, who have actually thought this out, and have sensible attitudes, woukl make the best gun owners, but funny enough, usually these people are well past the point of feeling they need one.

" Owning a gun with a readiness to kill is the supreme expression of intolerance"

I agree with you and percieve a WORLD of difference in the european attitudes and the American ones in this area. Killing is a BIG part of our heritage and culture here. The west STILL glorifies guns, war, and violence, and romanticizes the entire concepts.
To be honest with you, most americans do not even begin to understand the term 'respect'.
We are a quite disrespectful people, generally, who tend to see it as our BIRTHRIGHT to pull a gun on someone. We are taught way too much reverence for killing, from multiple angles and vectors.
If I take a 6 year old child and desensitize him by teaching him to kill animals, ( no, not for food, or self-defense, but a barbaric 'sport')
then I, without realizing it, have begun the process of dehumanization.
Once you've killed a few deer and gutted them, it becomes a lot easier to 'turn off the switch' and do some grisly stuff. This is the same 'switch' you turn off to kill any living thing.I know this, because I was taught all this, and I know what this culture is about.

Even target practice is only honing and sharpening their skills for killing.

....and why introduce a 5 year old child to this world in the first place?
Down here, thats the NORM, not the exception....children are basicaqlly indoctrinated into this crap, and have fully formed attitudes and beliefs about it WAY before they are able to think about it with any clarity.

Why are we weighing our advancement as a culture and race down by saddling ourselves with such psychological barriers?

These connections are real, it DOES get easier and easier to kill the more you do it, and it makes no difference in the psyche if you start on squirrels, prostitutes or Wild lions in Africa, Desensitizing is an unseparable part of hunting, which is the main way in westernized culture that guns are transmitted from one generation to the next.

It's wrong, period.

 

[Guest]

we always complain about society blaming drugs. and we say:"when you fall from a mountain, you don't blame the mountain". so, why are we blaming weapons ?
switzerland has a gun culture also, but do you hear terrifying news from there ? as a matter of fact, it is rare to hear a piece of news from switzerland, because they can live with it. they have the same guns that exist in the US.

 

[spice]

Not blaming the weapons, but they ARE the objects that we fixate our nonsensical love for carnage and killing on, and since they are so easy to obtain, I say that the weapon itself does shoiulder some of the blame, sense it really has no purpose other than the obvious....

If I had actually been around any sensible gun owners, perhaps I could see for myself that some people are sane in this respect, but I haven't, so I can't.

For defensive purposes only, maybe I could see it, but it would be easier to remove oneself from an area where one feels endangered.

...and smarter.

 

[Meduzz]

one the one side, i hate guns

on the other side, i love to play first person shooters. (counterstrike source)
it's also kind of a dehumanization, but it's fun and not real.

opinions?