would prescription MAOI's substitute?

[druglessdouglas]

ive not had the oportunity to try dmt yet. im planning it real soon and have researched a fair bit over the years(ive learned most from you guys!) would an over the counter MAOI such as tranylcypromine (which has a stimulant efect) be a good substitute for syrian rue? im not a fan of harmaline family. ive done it on its own and diddnt enjoy much. maybe even yohimbe as ive got a heap lying about the house. what dou you think? :retard:

 

[JustinNed]

I would think that an MAOI is an MAOI, synthetic or natural and should have the same effects. I'm not familiar with what you posted, but there could be something else in the pill to counteract or etc. Correct me if I'm wrong, for I am no expert!

 

[druglessdouglas]

nor am i! dmt i only know in theory so far but wouldnt want to waste any. im not rich and waste nothing if poss. thanks for the input

 

[magickmumu]

I always prefer plants above pills.

 

[Meduzz]

:idea: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tranylcypromine

It affects tryptamine, 5-HT, melatonin, epinephrine, norepinephrine, dopamine, histamine, phenylethylamine and other amines, as well as having some anticholinergic effect.

 

[druglessdouglas]

thank you for the heads-up. its the bin for these monsters. shame, cos theyre quite a nice hit in themselves. ive yohimbe as well its side effects are only embarasing in public :thumbsdown:

 

[GOD]

Natural MAOIs have been used for thousands of years across the world and have been shown to be safe . Chemical MAOIs ( usualy ? ) have longer lasting effects , and side effects of their own , and side effects in conection with other chemicals . They have not been tested for thousands of years . So it recomended not to use them for activating DMT . The effects of MAOIs are boring on their own for most people .

Yohimbie is boring bad shit = snotty , sniveling , shaking , nervous shit with palputations .

 

[druglessdouglas]

well i dont like harma, so can you suggest an alternative? all input gets put in

 

[GOD]

Hmmm ! The effects of Harmala are the effects of MAOI = it doesnt matter what you take to oraly activate DMT you are , at least , going to get the effects of MAOI . OR , it aint gonna work..... Or you are going to get that plus other , not calculable effects when you take chemical MAOIs . If i were you i would try taking 20 gramms of P.Harmala , on its own , and see what happens = next to nothing exept a feeling that something is about to happen........ and it doesnt . Playing with the actions of a MAOI are similar to shiting in your own brain = jenkem through a drip ......

Without MAOIs you have to sniff it , smoke it or fix it.......

Have you tried Harmala analy ??? Its realy "interesting" but you have to lie on your belly for several hours or ..............swim in shit dripping down your leg ....

 

[druglessdouglas]

ive taken syrian rue on its own, thats why i know i dont like harma. im sure in aya itll be totally different. ill give it a try. ive sourced mimosa via other links here, ill send off in the next week or so. carry on up the amazon. as for anal harma, my ass is too tight to effectivly dose. do you grease it first? would a cork help? do you sugest farting before and if so how long should you fart for to get the benefit?1day or a hole weak

 

[endlessness]

ok look

how much syrian rue did you take, and in what way did you prepare it? this makes a lot of difference..


if you want a substitute for syrian rue or b. caapi, the one to get is MOCLOBEMIDE (aurorix) .. It is also a short acting Reversible MAO-A Inhibitor that has little or no interaction with tyramine-containing foods, so its quite safe in this sense too.. People report that only 1 pill of 150mg is necessary for the mao inhibiting effect (and you take the dmt 30 mins after...)

 

[druglessdouglas]

endlessness, thanks. i cant remember how muck i took it was years ago. ill look into your sugestion. i ll prob. go for the banisteropsis, ive found a source

 

[Goran.Hrsak]

HEAR THIS! FROM ALL MAOi MEDS ONLY SELEGILINUM WORKS. BUT YOU WILL NEED TO TAKE SOMETHING NEAR 40-50mg. NORMAL DOSE FOR PARKINSON DISEASE IS 5mg IN MORNING AND 5mg IN NOON. 10mg AND 10mg FOR DEPRESSION TREATMENT. 20MG PENETRATE WITH MAO-B INHIBITION ALSO MAO-A INHIBITION.

HARMALINE, TELEPATHINE, HARMINE, *.*HARMALINE IS VERY STRONG REVERSIBLE (IN ONE WAY) MAOi. THREE CLASSIC MAOi IN ADepressive FORM ARE VERY LOW, SLOW, TIME BUILDING(PLASMA) MAOi. YOU NEED TO TAKE THEM MINIMUM 2-3 WEEKS OF YOU WANT TO USE THEM AS SUBSTITUTE FOR PEGANUM ALKALOIDS (peganum alkaloids is name for all ENTHEOGENS potions with MAOi and natural strong MAOi)

AURORIX (meclobemide) is RIMAO BUT VERY LIMITED!! VERY LOW PLASMA LIFE TIME, LOW ACTION, "SMART" MAOi - TARGETS SPECIFIC SEROTONIN MAO ENZYMES.
BUT 1500-2500miligrams OF IT CAN PRODUCE ENOUGH INHIBITION FOR DMT ACTION.

ALSO PEGANUM ALKALOIDS AND ALL FAST ACTING MAOi ARE VERY SAFE.
IF YOU EAT CHEESE, SAUSAGES, DRY MEAT, SPECIFIC FISH OR DRINK RED (OR OLD WHITE) WINE, YOU ARE SAFE FROM SEROTONINE SYNDROM! PEGANUM DOESN'T PRODUCE POSIBLLY FATAL EFFECTS LIKE THREE CLASSIC MAOi WHICH ARE USED FOR ADEPRESSIVE TREATMENT.
CLASSIC THREE ARE: Isocarboxazid, Phenelzine, Tranylcypromine

YOHIMBINE, 5-Meo-DMT, PASSION FLOWER ARE TO WEAK, FULL WEAK MAOi, SO DO NOT USE THEM AS MAOi SUBSTITUTE! YOU CAN ONLY DAMAGE YOURS TICKER AND BLOOD VESSELS.

PEACE
LIGHT
BLESS
LOVE

 

[endlessness]

HEAR THIS! FROM ALL MAOi MEDS ONLY SELEGILINUM WORKS.
AURORIX (meclobemide) is RIMAO BUT VERY LIMITED!! VERY LOW PLASMA LIFE TIME, LOW ACTION, "SMART" MAOi - TARGETS SPECIFIC SEROTONIN MAO ENZYMES.
BUT 1500-2500miligrams OF IT CAN PRODUCE ENOUGH INHIBITION FOR DMT ACTION.

well, I disagree...

I can´t say it for myself, but a close friend has taken moclobemide several times as MAOI for pharmahuasca, and says only 150mg are necessary... Also just read the trip reports around, people usually take 150mg for this purpouse.. Lycaeum also mentions 75-100mg necessary for potentiating entheogens, and last but not least, jonathan ott himself mentions only 75-300mg necessary for maoi action in pharmahuasca....


btw, moclobemide is also safe for food interaction.. BUT.. Pharmaceutical interactions (such as if you´re taking prozac, or others) are still very dangerous! beware!


On a side note: The amount of maoi necessary for each person seems to depend on the diet of the person... People with bad diet, industrialized food and so on (high in tyramine content) will most likely have developed more MAO enzymes in their bodies in general, therefore will need a bigger amount of MAOI for ayahuasca/pharmahuasca to have an effect. People with good eating habits (more fresh food and so on), in the opposite hand, will need less MAOI

in any case, it´s always safer to start with smaller doses, and work your way up


personally, I have only done real ayahuasca, or syrian rue+dmt, which worked great.. Im not a fan of the pharmaceutical industry, so if I had the choice I would always go for the natural stuff... Syrian rue at 2g dosage was perfect amount of MAOI for me.. some people say 3,5g , but I feel its not necessary so much (though I have a very good fresh food diet, so this may influence in me needing less maoi)... But in any case, if I had to go for one pharmaceutical maoi, I would go for 150mg of moclobemide, half an hour to one hour before takign the dmt or dmt containing plant

 

[GOD]

MAOIs are MAOIs and all have the effects of MAOIs . The only difference is the length of action and the strength of the action . Why should anyone abuse pharmacuticals when they can use natural MAOIs ?

When i walk down the street and see something brown , smelly and steaming i dont have to go and put my finger in it and taste it to see if its chocolate .

My body is a temple not a dump for chemical waste .

 

[endlessness]

MAOIs are MAOIs and all have the effects of MAOIs . The only difference is the length of action and the strength of the action .

no. There are differences in maois such as, if they are reversible or not, act on mao-a or mao-b, which makes tons of difference for example for how it will work out with food interaction

Why should anyone abuse pharmacuticals when they can use natural MAOIs ?

you are already supposing that whoever uses these pharmaceuticals are ´abusing´. Dont suppose too much, it´s bad for your health.

I know people who use it very respectfully (though I have already argued with them against pharmaceutical industry, but still what they do is definitely not ´abuse´)

When i walk down the street and see something brown , smelly and steaming i dont have to go and put my finger in it and taste it to see if its chocolate .

I didnt catch what´s this analogy supposed to relate to

My body is a temple not a dump for chemical waste .

´natural´ substances also contain chemicals. Being natural or not doesnt mean its good or not for your body. Take a bit of curare, get bitten by a poisonous snake or so on and you´ll see.. Plants are also chemical factories. Remember nature does not have human morals, this is all imposed/externalized/projected.

That being said, I also tend towards (some) natural substances instead of chemical, but not because of an illusionary romantic view that ´nature is good, man-produced is bad´.. It´s rather because, firstly, I dont want to give money to the pharmaceutical industry. Secondly, because I dont want to ingest substances that are not proven to be safe (for example thousands of years of human use without problems). Not to mention I dont want to take substances that for their existance, thousands of animal testing was necessary.

btw, if you are so confident on ´your body being a temple´, I guess you eat perfectly, no industrial products at all, and also dont watch tv, right? or else what you are saying is hypocrisy.

 

[GOD]

Did your white stick and guide dog get run over by a car ? Dont project things on me . And for the person thats taking it the physical and mental effects of MAOIs are virtualy the same . Also who gives a fuck if something is theoreticaly reversable when the damage has already been done .

The rest is to stupid to reply to .

 

[endlessness]

Did your white stick and guide dog get run over by a car ? Dont project things on me . And for the person thats taking it the physical and mental effects of MAOIs are virtualy the same . Also who gives a fuck if something is theoreticaly reversable when the damage has already been done .

It makes a world of difference..

case 1 - reversible maoi - person takes reversible maoi that acts only on mao-a, and eats aged cheese - nothing happens

case 2 - irreversible maoi - person takes irreversible maoi that acts on mao-b, and eats aged cheese - person has serotonin syndrome, increased pressure, may have rupture in brain vessel, maybe person dies.

if you dont see the difference, then I guess indeed we should stop discussing

when the damage has already been done

what damage are you talking about?

 

[Goran.Hrsak]

GOD I respect you, but you are really, really wrong bout something!
Selegilinum, NIAR-JUMEX is medicine (MAOi B under 20mg, 20++ also MAOi A) with neuronal protective properties! If U start to take it at your 35-40, Alzheimer and Parkinson disease chance fall near zero. Jumex protect your brain from free neuronal radicals, protect your brain from aging, improve memory and so on. Look bout it on net. No shit!

 

[GOD]

The chemicals you are talking about are not natural they are synthetic pharmaceuticals and they have not been properly tested .

You didnt answer my question - why should anyone take untested things if they can take Ayahuasca or P.Harmala ?

I started with vegetarianism in 1958 , the last time i ate meat was a single bite , that i spat out , from a hotdog 34 years ago . The only animal product i eat since then is about a liter of milk a day because i dont know any other adequate source of vitamin B 12 . I have two cups of tea a day , one earl grey and one green tea . I eat 4 teaspoon fulls of sugar a day in warm drinks , sometimes less . I do not drink coffee . I take no pharmacutical medicins unless i have no choice . At the moment i have to take interferon and ribavirin . I have also been prescribed ritalin and valium , all because i have hepatitis C 1a from a blood transfusion i had to have or die . ( and i definately would not do that again , i`d rather die ) . I dont eat any cakes or sweets . I dont take drugs . I dont smoke anything . I dont drink alcohol . I eat 400 gramms of vegetables every day and a bowl of musli = about 400 gramms . I eat 25 gramms of tomato paste a day . I dont eat any fryed foods . I do watch TV but only sensible documentarys and i have never eaten a television . I do not read newspapers . I am normaly the perfect weight for my size and my doctors say my health is very good for my age . = i have the body and normaly the fitness of some one 20 years younger than me . When i`m not ill i do weight training most days , especialy when i read shit like you write . I dont go on busses or trains or airoplanes i ride my bycycle or walk . The only time i go in cars is if i go to vuuv or something with a friend . Compaire that to what you have projected on me and your life style and get on your knees .

" or else what you are saying is hypocrisy."

What a hipocritical statement , whos 100% perfect , do you expect me to be jesus ? I try to do my best . Are you perfect ?

"but not because of an illusionary romantic view that ´nature is good, man-produced is bad" - " natural or not doesnt mean its good or not for your body"

Dont project your personal crap on me . I never said that and i dont think that as i just said when i talked about the medicines i have to take to be cured . I dont take them because i want to be cured for myself , i take them so i dont give it anyone else . I have lost 8 kilos in the last three months and all my muscle mass because of the side effects wich means i can get to the shop thats 300 meters away 2 times a month but then i`m fucked for three days . I can only eat my food liquidised and have to force myself to eat .

"I dont want to give money to the pharmaceutical industry."

Where do you get your pills from then ? Steal them ?

" because I dont want to ingest substances that are not proven to be safe" - "I dont want to take substances that for their existance, thousands of animal testing was necessary. "

Then why are you advertising them and recomending people to take them ? Could it be hipocracy ? Or ignorance ? Or stupidity ? Or have you got a sick ego ? Or is it just that you are talking crap ?

Please tell me who can take a pill to oraly activate DMT and say wich MAOIs it contains ? If a person respects themselves and knows what they are doing they dont eat for 4 hours before an ayahuasca experience so what you have said is irelevant .

High Goran , Thanks for the info . I understand what you are saying but it doesnt realy have anything to do with using pharmaceuticals to oraly activate DMT . Or why a person should use and pay for expensive untested pharmaceuticals if they can get P.Harmal for about 3 euros a kilo from most asia shops .