Quoi de neuf ?

Bienvenue sur Psychonaut.fr !

En vous enregistrant, vous pourrez discuter de psychotropes, écrire vos meilleurs trip-reports et mieux connaitre la communauté

Je m'inscris!

Proposal would outlaw hallucinogenic salvia

Dr. Leospace

Alpiniste Kundalini
Inscrit
28 Oct 2005
Messages
686
Salvia will probably be outlawed after Brett killed himself. History is repeating itself. Some stupid guy kills himself after taking some drugs, he probably would have killed himself anyway but who cares.

People look for some excuse, we can’t blame the music anymore so let’s blame the drugs! The drug is outlawed and people start using more dangerous street drugs - or even worse - they start making there own drugs from some chemical cleaning stuff! At the end more people are addicted, sick or death!


This is the news article:

From delawareonline by Mike Chalmers

Salvia Divinorum Herb, available legally through many Web vendors, would be placed in same category as heroin, LSD.

A hallucinogenic herb that may have contributed to the suicide of a Salesianum School senior in January would become an illegal drug under a proposed state law.

Salvia divinorum, which is widely and legally available through hundreds of Internet sites, would become a Schedule I controlled substance under Senate Bill 259, putting it in the same category as heroin and LSD. The Senate Health and Social Services Committee sent the bill to the full Senate after a hearing Wednesday.

The bill’s prime sponsor, Sen. Karen Peterson, D-Stanton, named it "Brett’s Law" after 17-year-old Brett Chidester of Pike Creek. He began smoking salvia divinorum last summer, apparently causing him to believe he had gained insights into the universe and that life was pointless. He killed himself by carbon monoxide poisoning Jan. 23.

The teen’s parents, Kathy and Dennis Chidester, urged senators to outlaw salvia because of the powerful effect it had on their son.

"He was a great student, an excellent son," Kathy Chidester said. "I just think he might have had some mild depression and, combine that with salvia, it was a lethal combination."

If legislators pass the bill, Delaware would become the third state — along with Missouri and Louisiana — to outlaw salvia divinorum. The bill already has 21 co-sponsors in the Senate and House. Congressional efforts to ban salvia have failed, even though the federal Drug Enforcement Agency considers it a "drug of concern" because of its wide availability, potential for abuse and unknown long-term effects.

"Kids shouldn’t be able to buy this online," Peterson said. "It’s the equivalent of LSD, so I figured that’s where it belongs."

Salvia’s main ingredient, salvinorin A, is as potent as LSD, making it the world’s most powerful natural hallucinogen, said Bryan Roth, a leading salvia researcher at Case Western Reserve University in Cleveland.When salvia leaves are chewed or smoked, users experience powerful visions that make them believe they’re in an alternate time and place, he said.

Roth said salvinorin A has been shown to have a depressive effect on mice in the laboratory. There have been no studies linking salvia to suicide and depression in humans, he said.

Making salvia a Schedule I controlled substance would not affect its availability for research, he said.

"I don’t think we have anything to gain by not scheduling it," Roth said. "If there were more of a barrier there, that’s not a bad thing."

Daniel Siebert, a California botanist who sells salvia online and promotes its responsible use, called Peterson’s bill "premature and a bit misguided."

Brett Chidester’s salvia use might have been more a symptom than a cause of his personal problems, said Siebert, who said none of the thousands of salvia users he has talked to ever expressed suicidal thoughts. In fact, some credit salvia for relieving their depression, he said.

"I don’t think it’s right to blame salvia for putting those thoughts in his head," Siebert said. "It’s not impossible that he had some crazy trip and decided to act on those crazy ideas, but it’s very unlikely."

Police and health officials said salvia is not a widespread or well known drug in Delaware.

Kathy Chidester said she has mixed feelings about her son being the inspiration for a drug law.

"It breaks my heart that I need to have a law like that named after my son," she said. "I don’t think Brett would want to be known for a law like that, but I think of it as an honor."
 

forest

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
30 Déc 2005
Messages
1 264
jesus, wat een bastards, ze hebben geen idee waar ze het over hebben
 

HeartCore

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
22 Août 2004
Messages
5 284
History repeats itself, paranoid lawmakers are waiting for incidents like this.

This is the pharmacratic inquisition at its best.

Makes me sick...
 

Ilian

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
14 Fev 2006
Messages
1 028
"I don’t think Brett would want to be known for a law like that, but I think of it as an honor."
pathetic people..
with such a great availability theyll have a hard time prohibiting it (read: lots of money and casualties). there are so many people growing salvia already, prohibition has no chance.
 

ProStoner

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
18 Juin 2004
Messages
1 974
HeartCore a dit:
History repeats itself, paranoid lawmakers are waiting for incidents like this.

This is the pharmacratic inquisition at its best.

oh my god..
indeed another example of history repeating itself
ALL THE PEOPLE that judge this drug(in this story) .. ALL HAVE NEVER SMOKED IT
and why ?? because its endangers their credibility BUT if u ask me the people that HAVE smoked it are much much more convincing to me then the ones who havnt and even have to guts to judge it...
they have absolutely no idea what they are talking about
its so sad
 

jilola

Neurotransmetteur
Inscrit
10 Avr 2006
Messages
70
Ireland passsed emergnecy lwgislation banning psychedelic mushrooms after a guy fell off a balcony on alcohol and shrooms.
No info seems to be available on the cause of the falling, ie. perhaps the guy was too drunk and just staggered and fell?

Anyway, mushrooms are now illegal in Ireland. One uncertain death and the state falls over itself to pass legislation while thousands die of tobacco, alcohol, traffic, casual violence, domestic fire.. the list goes on.

Sense? Perspective? Reason?
 

HeartCore

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
22 Août 2004
Messages
5 284
This is ridiculous (shrooms in Ireland).

The thing is, plants have no rights. Anyone with political power can outlaw a plant and the plant will just let it happen. This may sound like an open door but think about it. Years back we had this guy that listened to Judas Priest music and killed himself. The family of the guy was quick to speak out their wish for banning Judas Priest music making it illegal.

Ofcourse this never happened because Judas Priest had a management and legal department behind. Management that Salvia or any other plant doesnt have.

Maybe this can be a step in the right direction, a world wide organisation that speaks up for plants. Not sure where to start though...
 

forest

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
30 Déc 2005
Messages
1 264
yes, but than you would have to have someone who would talk to plants and that wouldn't be that hard, but plants don't really come up for they're rights I think, they're too forgiving and too nice. maybe I'm wrong.

but it's a nice idea that brought a smile to my face
 

HeartCore

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
22 Août 2004
Messages
5 284
yes, but than you would have to have someone who would talk to plants and that wouldn't be that hard, but plants don't really come up for they're rights I think, they're too forgiving and too nice. maybe I'm wrong.

but it's a nice idea that brought a smile to my face

:)

A shaman talks to plants all the time, no problem there ;)

Nice idea, thanks, now reworking it into a GREAT idea :)
 
G

Guest

Invité
Man, always the same story over and over and over again.
It's so sad that after all these thousands of years people still have a very narrow space in there heads.
People are to damn afraid to be themselves.

But man, that free the plant idea also made me grin.
That would be a good cause to make happen :thumbsup:
 

jilola

Neurotransmetteur
Inscrit
10 Avr 2006
Messages
70
Making salvia a Schedule I controlled substance would not affect its availability for research, he said.
This is by definition utter horseshit.
Schedule 1 is for substances with severe addiction and abuse potential and NO known medical use.
A number of outcomes may follow from that statement:
If they classify this in Sched 1 and allow research then they have created a precedent for allowing research on all the other Sched 1 substances.
They will not allow that. Thus, if Salvia is schedule Sched 1 it will by defintion of the scheduling be totally and utterly banned from any use and research.

The only reason someone would claim otherwise is to appease the current researchers until the scheduling is in force. By that time it'll be too late.
 

HeartCore

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
22 Août 2004
Messages
5 284
I dont entirely agree that research is not possible, in the 90's clearance was given for dmt research while that was and still is a schedule 1 drug as well.

Prohibition does frustrate the research though because in the field of psychedelics, research is part chemical but primarily experiental report. Now the more subjects, the more precise you research so prohibition is limiting that.
 

patilan420

Glandeuse pinéale
Inscrit
24 Déc 2005
Messages
190
Shit!!

it happening again..

They want to do it, they found a "reason" to do it, so they will do it ..
So now what?
They can do what they want, but they cannot stop me from doing what I want.
("how far can they control my mind" just said the voice from the track , "Cannabinoid" by Cosmosis, which is now playing from the winamp)

Marihuana is illegal, but this will not stop us of planting it, smoking it and shareing seads and info how to hide it from the drug-law.

DMT is also illegal, but it's presense is imposible to be prooved (at least in Bulgaria there is no way to proove it, and it seems in Germany also)
So when they checked me on the german border and found a botle of ayahuaska and asked "What's this" and I anwered "It's herbal tea" they let me go.

What about the salvinorin?
Is it posible to be positively tested by cheep test like MJ, is it hard to proove it like psylocibin or it's nearly imposible like DMT?

If they catch me with some salvia and ask"what's this" and if I answer "it's mint"(or "it's basilicum"), can they PROOVE that I lie??


anyway, forbiden or no, It EXISTS, and it's growing.
So I will continue planting it and using It nomatter if someone just said "Don't do it, or I'l charge you and posibly put you in jail".

"My skin is a border, in which I and only I deside what will enter, and what will not"
 

jilola

Neurotransmetteur
Inscrit
10 Avr 2006
Messages
70
HeartCore a dit:
I dont entirely agree that research is not possible, in the 90's clearance was given for dmt research while that was and still is a schedule 1 drug as well.
Care to give a link? That would be a possible precedent to gaining access to research on other substanbces as well?
 

tryptonaut

Holofractale de l'hypervérité
Inscrit
20 Nov 2004
Messages
3 440
HeartCore wrote:
I dont entirely agree that research is not possible, in the 90's clearance was given for dmt research while that was and still is a schedule 1 drug as well.

Care to give a link? That would be a possible precedent to gaining access to research on other substanbces as well?

I think HeartCore refers to the DMT research by Dr. Rick Strassmann. Strassmann has written a book about it which is called "DMT the spirit molecule" :)
Apparently it wasn't very easy to get everything cleared for this research project, it took years until he was able to start...
 
Haut