Biodiversity In Salvia

[Subtle_Nod]

Presumably, since Salvia can and does set viable seed, this is most likely the way nature saw things going before people got their hands on it.

I do not think that if I was to guess that 95% of all Salvia Divinorum was a clone that I would meet a lot of opposition.

It would not be the first time that humans have found vegetative traits that they liked and decided to step in and "freeze time". Granny Smith Apple's (seemingly) are one such example.

I doubt that going against the natural order of things will end well. If most of the Salvia Divinorum in circulation are clones, and not only clones but clones hundreds of years out of step with the rest of the planet, are we doing it any favors?

The other thing that strikes me as being slightly off is that other plants with "Human Uses" are always being selectively bred for this trait or that.

Why not Salvlia?

Firstly, let's assume that Salvia Divinorum can be crossed with other plants in the same genus.

Firstly, the traits that we want to enhance that Salvia Divinorum already possesses.

• Salvinorin.[/*:m:149mojah]
• Large Leaf Size (personal opinion)[/*:m:149mojah]

Next. the things that Salvia Divinorum could be added.

• More resistant to moisture loss.[/*:m:149mojah]
• More resistant to direct sunlight.[/*:m:149mojah]
• Stronger stems. Without being staked, currently, it tends to fall over once it is very tall.[/*:m:149mojah]
• Higher leaf concentration. Linked to higher yield.[/*:m:149mojah]
• Increased Fertility.[/*:m:149mojah]
• Increased Seed Viability.[/*:m:149mojah]

If anyone has anything they could add to either list, I would be interested in adding it. Also, if anyone knows of existing plants of the Salvia genus that posses desired traits, ditto.[/i]

 

[JustinNed]

I haven't read or heard about any salvia crossbreeds. But of course the plants do produce seeds that are going to be viable to a certain percentage. As far as I am aware though the Salvia plant has two ways of reproducing, firstly by seeds. The second is truly amazing, and shows how great nature can be. The plant falling over is by no means a bad thing, because this is the main way that Salvia plants reproduce.

Of course though, I'm no botanist!

 

[Subtle_Nod]

The second is truly amazing, and shows how great nature can be. The plant falling over is by no means a bad thing, because this is the main way that Salvia plants reproduce.

Except that those are all genetic clones - no diversity, no evolution. That was really my point entirely. Clones have the exact same properties. A seed produced Salvia Divinorum has a chance of gaining things like pest resistance, a clone does not.

Plus, as soon as anything looses the ability to adapt it can disappear quite quickly. If there was a specifically bad fungus, there would be no natural resistance and never could be through just cloning. The fungus however would adapt to be better at killing the salvia. Example only.

Salvia clones itself naturally, but it is likely it did so to find sexual partners. It's possible that people saw cloning as a quicker way to grow it. They may even have selectively kept plants that had clones that rooted well, resulting in plants that do not seed well. Pure speculation. It does not matter.

I understand how Salvia has propagated in the past but there is no reason it could not be improved upon.

Moisture loss and direct sunlight seem to be amongst it's biggest problems. Reasons against trying to fix em?

 

[Meduzz]

As long as there is mutation there is diversity.

Btw, if all salvia plants would be clones you can't speed up evolution by crossing 2 clones, that just gives another clone... :wink:

People should only clone healthy plants and select carefully.

 

[GSDIZ.COM]

good thing salvia plants..



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[Forkbender]

Btw, if all salvia plants would be clones you can't speed up evolution by crossing 2 clones, that just gives another clone... :wink:

I think he was talking about crossing it with another salvia (sage/salie) species, hoping that salvinorin will be taken along the way besides some useful properties of the other salvia.

 

[Subtle_Nod]

I think he was talking about crossing it with another salvia (sage/salie) species, hoping that salvinorin will be taken along the way besides some useful properties of the other salvia.

Bingo.

There are other active members of the salvia family that would make good candidates for cross breading. They have effects that vary from Salvia that would if nothing else, make cross breeds that produced combinations of those effects interesting.

Even if an inactive salvia was chosen for the cross, it is not outside the realms of possibility to fix the Salvinorin producing trait. With careful selection, it is not impossible that higher potency plants could be produced but more importantly, because of Salvia's need for a high level of moisture and it's tendency to burn in direct sunlight, a more hardy plant could be produced.

If this was any other plant, people would be experimenting with the potential strains that could be created. Unfortunately, there was a myth that Salvia would never produce viable seed. This has been proved to be false. Seed viability is very low, but that is to be expected in a plant that was selectively bred for it's ability to clone well.

Potency doesn't come high on my list. There are plenty of extraction techniques around.

Hardiness and seed viability I deem highest.

My experimental nature puts the tens of thousands of possible combinations second.

 

[Forkbender]

It sounds like an interesting experiment. Maybe you can ask Daniel Siebert of sagewisdom.org on his opinion/knowledge on this matter. I'm sure he will be happy to reply and shed more light on the topic.

 

[Subtle_Nod]

It sounds like an interesting experiment. Maybe you can ask Daniel Siebert of sagewisdom.org on his opinion/knowledge on this matter. I'm sure he will be happy to reply and shed more light on the topic.

I made the assumption he would probably get too much email to answer but you are probably right. Can't hurt too much to try.

 

[Meduzz]

Same genus doesn't mean they can be crossed... Genus = Salvia
S. Oficinalis and S.Divinorum are different species, because they can't have sex with each other.

 

[Subtle_Nod]

Same genus doesn't mean they can be crossed... Genus = Salvia
S. Oficinalis and S.Divinorum are different species, because they can't have sex with each other.

True.

There are a lot of theoretically compatible plants though:

Salvia sahandica,
Salvia castanea,
Salvia coccinea...

Quite a big list. Why did you mention Oficinalis? Flavor or just example?

 

[Meduzz]

Quite a big list. Why did you mention Oficinalis? Flavor or just example?

Example... It's the best known salvia (to some second best )