On the Validity of Psychedelic Experiences

[Danielise]

We're having a discussion on this topic in the philosophy club at my school this evening. If anyone wants to give me some extra resources to read up on prior to this evening, I'd be delighted.

 

[maxfreakout]

your having this discussion about illegal substances in a SCHOOL???? Wow i wish i went to your school!

you should definitely read the essay: 'The Bubble of Simulation: Subjective Experience as a Virtual Environment', it's here:
http://egodeath.com/BubbleOfSimulation.htm

Psychedelic drugs dont make you hallucinate, rather they make you realise that your ordinary (undrugged) perception is hallucinatory/dreamlike, is that a 'valid' realisation?

 

[IJesusChrist]

You have to realize that serotonin is a psychoactive... that is our "normal" reality - all our experience is mediated by the interactions of serotonin (+ a few others in the brain).

So changing those chemical mediators - how is it any less valid than serotonin?

 

[maxfreakout]

So changing those chemical mediators - how is it any less valid than serotonin?

how do you measure validity in the first place?

 

[IJesusChrist]

I would say action - reaction.

I do something, something happens. It is a valid perception of reality.

If I do something, and nothing happens - well I guess my perception isn't valid :lol:

I'm assuming whoever is directing danieliese's discussion is conditioned to believe that serotonin's interpretation of stimulus is a valid experience.

 

[Mescaline]

Haha, a course I did at uni a year ago had one lecture/two hour discussion concerning the same topic (the lecture actually started with the professor admitting to his experiences with LSD and magic mushrooms :lol. Don't have any texts on the subject though, nor any notes, and it's probably too late for that now anyway.

However, from what I remember by heart, and what I believe myself, is that psychedelic experiences are valid experiences because they can cause significant alterations in a person's personality, way of life, approach to life, mental state... pretty much everything. How can something that can have such a great impact not be a valid experience, for the person experiencing it?
Second (I think this is along the same lines as what IJC pointed out), what makes the "ordinary" configuration of the brain more valid than an "altered" configuration of the brain? Had evolution progressed differently, reality might have looked extremely different. And if it would be possible to compare this reality that would be the product of this different progression of evolution (let's call it reality X) to our contemporary "ordinary" reality, then reality X would probably resemble much more closely a "psychedelic reality", in the sense that it would be extremely different from our current ordinary reality, than it would resemble our current ordinary reality. This only further brings doubt to the notion that any experience of reality is more valid than any other experience of reality.

 

[Mescaline]

To establish or measure the validity of any experience or perception, one would need to have an example of a known valid experience or perception to compare it to.

Exactly. :idea: