My experience with Sally

[sychopk]

I purchased a couple of months ago a bottle of Salvia extract from the web and decided to give sally a shot. Being a huge skeptic the first couple of tries were not sucesful in producing any effect. After doing some research on proper use I gave it one last chance and I've never been the same.

My expperience was more Audio than visual. I heard a voice of a women speak to me. This voice has forever disturbed me since I find it dificult to believe it was a product of my imagination, It felt so real. The normal voice inside my head sounds like my own but this voice was that of a women and very kind and sweet.

What she said has changed me and I've never done Salvia since. The voice told me that natural drugs like marijuana and herself were long ago actual people who found a way to live on through these plants and that the trips people experience are result of the personality that person had when he/she was alive. As though the drugs contain the spiritual essence of these people or something. She warned me to not use synthetic drugs because they anger these spirits and they consider it disrespectful.

Since then I have not been able to stop using drugs like xanax and oxy but have considerably reduced use.

Thanks for taking your time to read my experience. have a nice day.

 

[Maru]

Interresting but I would not take 'Sally's voices' as the 'only holy truth'...
I guess that you feel some anxiety in life and that's why you use Xanax.
Maybe you feel also a bit of culpability for using Xanax.
Sally is a powerfull 'thoughts enhancer' and may increase greatly the culpability (whatever it's source). In my experience, she also increase my anxiety level even hours after dancing with her.
Envisage eventually that the voice heard might be your culpability feeling about using Xanax or another culpability which would lead to anxiety.

With Sally's help you can 'catch' quick thoughts and dig deeper in your thoughts to check the initial source of anxiety.

 

[sychopk]

I understand that it should not be taken as the only truth.

And thanks for the insight maybe it was my own thoughts afterall, any advice?

 

[Maru]

Ah well, you answered while I was editing my post

 

[Maru]

While under Sally's influence, there is indeed a feeling of 'another world' which becomes familiar whit time.
I can harldy think that this is a 'real' outside world :wink:
An hypothesis that come to my mind : Sally have the power to 'shift' our ego. Once shifted, we perceived our own thoughts and feelings from that shifted inner point of view, considering that theses are 'external' thougths/feelings.
But this would be like wearing pink sunglasses and saying that world has changed !

 

[sychopk]

It's true. Kinda silly to think the world has changed by wearing pink glasses :wink: .

I see so salvia projects to the outside our innermost feelings. Kinda like getting to know that side of you that you have hid away and ignore for some reason and seeing the world through these eyes. Interesting.

 

[Siq]

Hmmm, nice way of explaining this Maru, because I also experience the trips on Salvia as something completely alien; something very outside. The first few time I could not even perceive anything there because it was the first time I saw it. The visual objects were completely new concepts, no reference yet existed in my brain. Over time and experience and exploration I can now ever more clearly perceive that other world.

I know I should doubt the convinction that this world/realm/reality exists outside of my head, but that's because my conscience is there as a whole, so I feel like I am completely aware; no decrease in conscience allows me to perceive and think very clearly in fact.

I notice however that this realm unfolds in the void of thoughts in my head. In this void, this meditational mind with a only a clear conscience, but no thoughts .. there is the space for the effect to inhibbit. In order to stay within Salvia-land, I mustn't try to use things like memories and existing concepts to compare my current experience/perception or to utter what I experience to mates sitting besides me. Because in order to sustain the void, my mind has to stay clean of thoughts or processes. However I can almost allways speak very well-thought-over. But to utter something comprehendable I have to translate my perception to existing concepts and thus use my memory.

Still I must admit that the effect of Salvia is very convincing in appearing out of this world, and out of my head. This is why I am very curious about other peoples experiences.

 

[Maru]

Siq,

I wonder how you can manage to be free of thoughts... even with the highest doses, I may forget who I am but thoughts (inner verbal speaker) are always there. Ok , I can stop them for few seconds, but more... hmm maybe after 50 years of meditation ?

 

[sychopk]

Maybe after 50 years maybe less. It's amazing what humans can do with the right amount of time.

 

[Siq]

Well .. I am naturally relaxed. I have had my periods of doubt and thought, but especially when I've inhaled SD, my mind is swept clean in no-time and since I am not at all focussed on my memories or the "here-and-now"; there is nothing 'present enough' to be a thought. I am only observing and trying to absorb what I experience as unconscienctly as possible; trying to collect the data, but not processing it with known concept and ideas (which requires usage of the memorie; which needs space within that void).

It also allways leaves me peacefull and emty-headed (in a positive way).

Oh and yes, I suppose meditation helps. I'm not as active doing that as I would like to be, but before I sleep, in bed, I focus on breathing clearing my head; becomming aware of the thoughts that initiate in your mind .. then ignoring them, letting them fade.

 

[sychopk]

Nice. Anymore advice on how to clear the mind without the help of substances?

 

[Maru]

Brainwave (or related relaxing musics) technology is pretty helpful to relax.

 

[Guest]

i clear my mind when i dishwash. i take dishwashing seriously - when i soap a dish, i am soaping my own soul.
when i am angry, i throw a cup or a dish at the wall, and the effects on me are very rewarding.


i don't think that salvia neither outside or inside. i belive that all things are one. that below this "reality" lies another reality, with all the places, all the things that are, were and will be at the same point. even cientists say that all elements (with the exception of hidrogen, helium and perhaps a little lithium) are born inside the stars. that will make us sons of the stars; we are born FROM the universe. that means that you, I, and everyone else in this planet are born from one star that burst somewhere near. that means that SD is born from the same place. even the world she takes us is born from the same place. don't you think that if everyone has the same visions, hears the same voice, claims the same feelings...it is because all of it comes from the same place? the world has to exist somewhere, because everyone feels it! it existed even in the core of a star that died millions of years ago, you and I were there, but we were not born yet, and neither will die when our atoms will become other trillion things. we tend to belive that the only things that are, are the ones that we can touch, or look, or feel. that is not true...we cannot touch love, but how can one doubt it's existence ? and hate ? and freedom ? and our will ? because it is there, and it is neither outside or inside, it is us. all the things that we experience are us, because we are what we live.
anyway, that is my opinion, and therefore, you can think i'm an *sshole. maybe tomorrow i'll wake up and think: "shit, the only thing that makes my life real are the IRS papers!"

 

[Siq]

Well, I understand you have this your viewpoint, DayTripper, but I cannot relate to it, because for my comprehencion it's just too .. non-concrete.

I have a very rational, perhaps cold, interpretation, that is; many feeling we experience are physical trigger releases of substances in the body. It's effects are directly on some of our organs and inderectly on the way we feel .. which is dependant on the way we interpretthe impulse generated by this substance. This interpretation is again dependant, mostly (to my idea), on cummunial standard and partly on insticts (pre-programmed physical and mental reactions/links). But .. I'm drifting away now ..

----

My definition for being inside my head and outside my head is rather simple. Taken in account that what we perceive (sight in particular) is for a greater part completed by our brain, by links to ideas and concept in our memorie, still I dare to say that some things are not created/initiated in my head and some are. For example:

The keyboard I am typing on is not a creation of my mind. I can show every person on this world this object and they will also perceive it (perhaps not identity it as a keyboard, but they will see this object). This keyboard exists outside of my head

I am thinking of a blue car now .. can you see it? No, that's because it only exists within my mind and cannot be projected (without any medium) to be perceivable by other persons. This car exists inside my of head.

When tripping you may perceive things subjectively, that is; you may perceive something that somebody (anybody, everybosy) else wouldn't perceive (like you do). This subjective perception can either be initated/created by your thought (conscience or subconsciences) or induced by something else .. (Yes, we're on hard-definable truth now). This something else can be a organ (existing outside of us (our body/mind) that does influence our perception subjectively. There aren't many of these 'something else's' that are accepted as truth, but as with DMT; the consistency of comparable perceptions between multiple experiences and experiencers tends to show that we are dealing with one fenomenon (outside) instead of multiple subjective fenomena (inside). An example of a subjectively perceived, self-created/initiated fenomenon, drug-induced, is the perceived paranoid ideas I may get when smoking to much weed, or (generally) the things that are perceived by somebody suffering from a psychosis.

---

Ok, drifted off again, but that's my idea of inside and outside the mind. To me there is a concrete difference between the two (although, ofcourse, perception is allways subjective). Eventhough essentially all = one, there are still subdivisions that are true, I mean, since all is one and perhaps hence all is partly the same .. we still cannot eat bricks but do so with potatoes, eventhough they are essentially and initially the same. This is my point to show that there are certain undeniable subdivisions.

I am not calling anyone an asshole .. that's pointless, I believe in a certian thing you may call love .. naturally induced serotonie, for example I just like to discuss and get things clear, and other opinions .. so, thanks mate!

 

[Guest]

i can see that you have an empiric eye for reality, since you are quite a "separator" from both inside/outside world, and i truly respect that. my travels in the inside world, triggered by outside substances always assured me more of this, and i am not saying you are more or less experienced than i am - and i think that experience is pointless in this subject -, i just say that if there is a dialectic balance in the outside-inside, there is an interaction between, and if there is an interaction, it must be a close relation. in every close relation, two things will happen: if they came from the same place, they will separate from each other. if they came from separate places, they will merge onto one another. but i guess i cycle of this separation-merging-separation would be possible, but i am not sure.
anyway, i think that if a flower grows from a dead body, the deadbody would have a flower inside of him, because if the flower forms from his body, the spreaded atoms from the flower would already be in his body.


(oh, yes...the worlds!)


you mention that the keyboard is a part of the outside world. i disagree with you by two things: 1) the keyboard is comprehended by you, and it is formed in you brain; 2) if this is so, there must be an "keyboard concept" inside your mind. that means that there are no outside objects, and consequently, no outside world. the same goes to the inside world: if a visual comes from inside your mind, it was because your mind was set to this by an outside agent: dmt, or mescaline, or whatever; every aspect in which i think, makes me assured that there is no outside world, and the inside world is a very doubtful thing to be, because we need to be surely in one place, because how descartes proved, if i think, i therefore exist. but i belive this place is a point, like the universe before the bigbang. if the universe is expanding and will (perhaps) collapse in the big crunch, wouldn't that mean that the outside/inside worlds are merely a mirage, the temporary being of the unbalanced equilibrium of perfection: everything into one. nothing and everything would have the same meaning. the cientific theories point that the big bang was real (but, again, they might change tomorrow), and this unification has been real. and if the unity has been real, everything that exists or has existed, was already inside this point. even time was inside of it. our thoughts were there, our lifes, our trips, everything! into one thing that had no dimensions. and in that point, outside and inside were the same, so why shouldn't they be now ? if one is a nurse once, she is a nurse forever, even if she does not works at that profession. that's what i belive, but i, as i said, respect your opinion and i hope you will not hold a grugde against me.

peace!

 

[Siq]

Sure .. no pun taken at all

For me it's a paradox still. The experiences I have read about DMT led me to make a worldview/reality-interpretation that connects to modern theoretic physics; the quantumtheriories. This one contains a conscience a level at which energie has not even transformed into vibrations, vibration not yet into particles and particles into matter. A conscience that is shared among all (matter to energie), but risen above dimensions and time.

The problem I have with this (interpretation of) reality is that it doesn't exclude many things (or anything to a certain level). Nevertheless I believe that there are things (really imaginairy) that are not included in an apprehendale actual reality. You see, I believe in the existence of an actual reality, a reality that exists also when my conscience is not there to percieve it. But since this interpretation isn't concrete enough for my current experience of reality, it remains theory for me.

So there's my conservative (or commonly _the only_) world-view which is earth-based and dimension-embracing, including time. Perhaps these dimensions are slightly bendable, this won't affect my personal perception of them in a great way. It says walls, made of concrete, cannot be walked through (very handy tip!) and it says that I have to chew my pizza in order to be able to swallow it. Also; in this reality there this thingy of plastic that reflects few light, so appears black and has white symbols on thingies called buttons; a keybaord. This is not the keybaord as a concept in my head, this is the description of a piece of plastic, this description does not contain any values that are subjective.

See .. that's my interpretation of actual reality. Or perhaps conservative reality, but in this reality are the most rules we tend to live to, like gravity, electromagnetisme, comfortable toiletdesigns, musical instruments, dogs standing up on hind legs for a treat and laungage .. for example.

I don't totally dispel the 'higher' interpretation of truth (vibrans to energy having conscience), but it's not such an appearant fenonemom in our daily life. Hence I have a keyboard-object on my desk and a keyboard-concept in my head, but they are very very diffent things, and the latter isn't actual to me.