Kratom

[Morphine]

Howdy

I was wondering if wnyone with experience of opioids could tell me if Kratom would be a good product for me. I used to have a quite high daily consumption of 600-750mg of codeine a day. I have read a lot about this Kratom product and it really seem to be a good one. Cn you tell me about what package of teh four available is to choose before the other? What dosage might be good? The price is quite high so it would be nice to hear of which one is most effectful. What differs chewing and tea etc...

Please go ahead and give me some handful guidence

Thanks in advice and happy rush to you all.

 

[esin]

Kratom extract sucks.
Get the powdered leaves.

Mix it into a cup of hot water, drink it all without straining out the grounds. It tastes absolutely disgusting but it makes all the difference. Have a cup of any warm drink nearby to chase down the nastiness.

If you are tolerant to opioids i'd say start with 5-6g and go from there. My sweetspot is 8-9g of commercial kratom without tolerance. 10-12g with tolerance.

That's pretty high for most people but i like the dreamy trance the high doses produce

If you want to quit opiates be careful not to get a kratom habit as it is probably more expensive than codeine pills and it is still a mu-opioid agonist.
It's definitely great to quit opiates, but it's not that great to substitue addictions...

 

[Morphine]

Thanks for a satisfying answer. I will go for the powder. What about continous intake? Does it really get better after adding another 5-8 g's after 2-3h? When using codeine I found that the effective at-one-time dosage was ~250 and I used to start with 10x25mg around 17:00 and then another 250mg like 3h later and finally 200-250mg yet another 2 hours after that. It did certainly keep up the effect nd added a more stable rush.

It is indeed expensive,Kratom, I have noticed. I will try not to make it a habit and if it is good it's worth it. I wont get any more prescriptions on opioids. I went from oxicodone in high dosage for about 2½ months and then down to tramadol at quite high dosage, about 2800g (12x200g) of depot pills and that was at same time everyday about 18:00. Felt like if my heart nearly stopped every time and found that this was my maximum for good effect. I loved the sweating and intense dreaming and the hypnogogic hllucinations when lying down for sleep... nights were all a beautiful blur. Then I got back to codein and even if it is a pure member of the opioid family, I found codein impossible to get the same effective intensive rush I got from tramadol, unfortunatley. Been on opioids for 1½ year on daily usage now.

I really hope this kratom is damn good.

Would you know if this shows up in a urine sample? I have two visits every week to show I'm clean in order to keep my bensoe pills on prescription and can't afford to loose them after heavy use for severl years.

Any other good stuff you could recommend that has an obvious narcotic effect and is available from *******?

Regards,
Morhph

 

[esin]

Holy shit!! 2.8g of tramadol all at once? That's insane man. Not to sound like a preacher but from your description it sounds like bordering OD territory. Such a dose would probably be lethal for most non-tolerant folks.
Tramadol is a weak opioid, taking a high enough dose for oxy/morphine-like effects is seriously dangerous...

About continuous intake of kratom i can't help as i usually don't redose.

But if you are on the stuff 24/7 you will quickly gain an enormous tolerance that will prevent you from having any satifying effects anymore. Moreso than with true opiates, so i heard.

Personally, if i don't space my doses out at least 4-7 days apart it stops producing the effects i like. So i usually only do it once a week these days [and i only buy it every other month, as to not make a weekly habit out of it]. ymmv.

Logically kratom alkaloids shouldn't be detected in standart drug tests since it is structurally very different than opiates (or any other substances tested for in standart urinalysis), BUT i may be wrong.

There is nothing like kratom which is legal. Proper kava preparations have an obvious effect which can be considered more or less like benzodiazepines, but it isn't nearly as euphoric as thom.

I really hope this kratom is damn good.

Kratom is amazing, rest assured.
But your tolerance will most likely make it considerably weaker. If not unnoticeable...

 

[Morphine]

It was over a year I quit using Tramadol now so I am able to breath normal again :smirk: And yea, that dosage put me on the death limit but that was what I headed for. After quitting Tramadol and oxycontine, codeine replaced them but now I have been off codein as well since mid february so I should have lowered the tolerance to the very lowest. However, unfortunatley I seem to be very tolerant by nature but since Kratom (will order 50g of powedered Kratom today) is a new structure for my brain to chew on I cross my fingers. I will not "abuse" this product and use it daily. I will (try) to use it twice a week but I think I will go for the stronger dose at very first try, like 7-8g of tea the way you told me to prepare it. Thanks for that advice since I was wondering about if one should waste the soaked, strained Kratom leftovers or consume them - off course one should consume them as well :dead:

Bloody lords of darkness - I can't wait for that warmth spreading all inside by body, covering my mind with a smooth blanket of calmness and distress. That is what I expect from Kratom now... If it is close to codein I will be very much happy with this product.

The tests I do now are very basic - just a stick right down the cup of urine that will show positive or negative on either benso,amphetamine,thc and opioids. If there would be any indistinctness, like the result will show not positiv nor negativ, they will send it to the crimelabs for detailed analysis. I will tell you guys later if Kratom will show on the test or not!

Cheers

 

[esin]

I will tell you guys later if Kratom will show on the test or not!

That would be most appreciated =)

 

[Snapinho]

maybe i'm missing something, but where does such a high tolerance of opiates come from? too much using that shit? what is good for? and why substitute it with something else? some condition?
my apologies if i'm being ignorant but i was just really wondering... why use that stuff and twice a week? do you or your body actually need it?
an honest answer is welcome, i'm not judging but being very curious...

boom :truce:

 

[esin]

maybe i'm missing something, but where does such a high tolerance of opiates come from?

In Morphine's case, tolerance would stem from his one and a half year old daily use of pharmaceutical opiates. I was thinking he had just recently quit the stuff but as he apparently quitted in february most of his tolerance should have gone away by now.

In my case, I've had some tolerance to kratom when i tried dosing too often. It stopped producing the effects i liked about it so i spaced out my doses so i can enjoy the fullest of its effects.

-

The kratom alkaloids Mitragynine and 7-hydroxymitraginine, although being structurally related to indole based psychedelics, are delta and mu-opioid agonists.

They bond to delta-opioid receptors in lower doses, resulting in stimulation.
Mu in higher doses, producing opium-like effects.

As you may know repeated opioid use results in heavy tolerance. And also cross-tolerance between all substances that act on mu-opioid receptors.
That's the reason his tolerance to opiates would affect his tolerance to kratom.

what is good for?

It is a stimulant. Reduces Attention Deficit Disorder, like say Ritalin or Adderal.

It also effectively produces opiate-like effects in higher doses. Which makes it a strong euphoriant and potent pain-killer.

And it is also capable of stopping - or at least substantially decreasing - opiate withdrawal symptoms.

And it is not nearly as addicting as true opiates.
Which makes it an excellent tool to help break addictions, because it eliminates the withdrawal symptoms without merely postponing or delaying them.

why substitute it with something else? some condition?

As i said in my first post: it is great to stop using real opiates, but it is not that great to subtitue addictions.

Procedure should be once the withdrawal symptoms set in, a high dose of kratom is taken every day to eliminate these symptoms. When these symptoms cease to reappear the kratom is no longer necessary.
The user may than go through a phase of kratom withdrawal but this is much milder and easier to handle than opiate withdrawal.

why use that stuff and twice a week? do you or your body actually need it?

I use kratom every other month. In 'kratom months' i do it once a week, usually on sundays. In 'non kratom months' i don't use it.
I use it simply because i love the high. Neither my body or my mind needs it although they both enjoy it a lot

Morphine wants to feel the 'warmth' again without falling back into opiate addiction. I guess we can say that although his body doesn't need the drug anymore (he quit long enough ago), his mind still craves that delightful bliss that opiates produce...

 

[Morphine]

esin does a good job answering on my behalf and you're not ignorant at all, just ask. Anyway, I don't hide from my past and my weaknessess. I have had a quite complex abuse of all kind of drugs but mostly amphetamine by IV injections, and later on a crush for pills over all and also all along has the devilgod of alcohol been there causing not very much better situations than that "shit", as you call it, i.e opiates. That life started at the age of 14 and went some devastating 12+ years until things got under more control. We're not androids programmed to have the same life. I partly chose my ex-life but your in for a suprise once you want to change your way of living if you have dealt with heavy misuse of drugs combined with that special mentality some are born with that makes it harder to quit and go on than it is for others.

Further, now I do choose to buy this product, Kratom, to handle the psychical abstinens of my former livings and to indulge in what I hope will be a rush that gives me the nod without using the illegal and quite obviously more physical disastrous drugs like opium and its derivates. Also it's illegal and I nowadays have a familylife since 6 years that are worth fighting for but hey.. I can't drink alcohol because I will fall back into my abuse, I can't smoke a pot of sativa because I piss on a regular basis twice a week as mentioned, that means I can't take any of the common "street-drugs" like tramadol, morphine or heroin and I feel I really need some way to relax and I don't mean yoga meditation. That's just it I just wanna zimmer down.

If this Kratom turns out to be good acording to my terms and damands I will I will most likely continue to use it. However, I am totally sure that it is mentally very addictive if it really is so opiate alike that so many opiate experienced users says it is and might fuck a little with ones psyche.

Esin, another question to you now. I have read a lot about experiences and effectsat Erowid's Vault among others. What I wonder is this: Some user wrote that he found (for him) 6g on his way to take it to be a dose of which he got out something almost but not as strong as codeine, but the problem was that everytime he tried to break the limit to get a better and more intense high and increased the dose, he just went sick every time. Now I wonder if you have had this experience. Would be very sad if it had a "limit" like that... I know the opiates have their limits too but not in the way he explained.... you can read it here - it's short but me is worried. I ordered a bag of 50g powder yesterday so now I'm jsut awaiting it.

Cheers

 

[esin]

Kratom only ever made me sick twice.

The first was the first time i ever did it.
Low dose, like 3-4g, didn't get high but was queasy for the rest of the day.

The second time i wasn't familiar with the tolerance curb of the stuff yet.
I didn't take any for a month or so. Than i assumed i could eat my regular dose. Needless to say i was puking all over the place for 2h.

I found it like real opiates. You have to first gain a tolerance to the bad side-effects so you can enjoy the good ones.

Sometimes when i eat high doses i become slightly queasy but lying down makes it better. Smoking cannabis usually completely eliminates it but as far as i understood that's not an option for you...

I didn't understand if Snapinho's reply was directed at you, me or both. So i just tried to explain to him what we were both talking about.

 

[Snapinho]

another question then, and thanks a lot for being honest! takes a lot of courage man, good for you. my question was (i have no experience whatsoever with this and dont even have friends that used it [for the rest: i know ppl who have done almost everything ;])....

did you consider doing an iboga-session with some professional therapist? i guess they must be hard to find but i've read impressive stories about that stuff. allows you to kick the habit once and for all, if done properly...

well man, lemme know. you got my support at least.

big up... respect! :truce:

 

[tryptonaut]

In my opinion you won't get the real strong opiate feeling from Kratom. I had some smaller doses of Tramadol some time ago, in an amount where it just made me feel extremely well and very lively - you can get something like that from Kratom in low doses, which is very nice, but any dose above 5g of Kratom is not worth it in my opinion (it makes you lie down calmly without a desire to move, but not much of a euphoric feeling).
I've only once had a higher dose of opiates (Valoron/Tilidin), combined with alcohol and dope - it was extremely nice (unable to move but feeling like a Greek God in Olymp )
I don't think you can get that kind of feeling with Kratom (however it can make you feel well when you are down)

 

[Ketalargold]

hi everybody..I have a problem and u could help me..I'm going to buy some kratom (why leaves instead of extract?someone of you tried both of them?)
The question is:it's 45 days i stopped with methadone (max dosage 25 mg),then I used tramadol and in the last few days I used heroine...what a mistake..now i need kratom to beat withdrawal,can you give me some hints?can i mix kratom with something to boost his effect?how much i should buy?my addiction is quite mild but no more sopportable...help me...
please...

 

[esin]

Poppy tea gave me a bit more euphoria than a high dose of good kratom. PT lasted much longer though, and i felt a stronger addictive 'pull' the next few days.

I found the PT more sedating and a heavier high altogether.
And it gave me nausea and stomach aches, unlike kratom. Despite that, i did find it a nicer experience overall.

How did you consume your kratom? Would you filter the powder out of the tea or did you drank it all. Consuming the grounds makes a world of a difference, y'know?

As for me, i find any dose below 5g useless. 8g and up is where the fun begins for me YMMV.

Ketalargold, i did try both on various occasions.
The extract isn't nearly as strong a high as the powder.
It's much more stimulating and less narcotic/euphoric, in my experience. A lot easier to drink though.

It's similar high to making kratom tea but without drinking the grounds. I have reason to believe the truly narcotic constituents may not be very soluble in water.

 

[Morphine]

Hi again! Been away for a while.

I finally got my Kratom powder. First time i took it I was already on Tramadol, approx 700-900mg and boiled some water and poured it over 5g of kratom powder and drank it all including the powder - not too bad tasting at all. However after an hour I decided to intake another 5g since I felt nothing at all from the first 5g and that might not be so strange condiddering having Tramadol in my veins already. But the next 5g didn't do any difference so I just decided to stop it for that night and not "destroy" any more of the Kratom powder.

Yesterday I made a nice milkshake with milk, banana choklate powder and 10g Kratom powder (no icecream , I had none) and mixed it - very tasteful - no bittertaste at all, just good taste. I had no Tramadol or any other alike drugs in my blood, I just had my regular dosage of Alprazolam 1.5mg which is taken on daily basis. I hadn't eat for 5 hours and after 15-20 minutes I started to feel a welcomed effect of Kratom. Now I understood I need at least 10g to feel something.

It wasn't a strong high, not an intensive rush. I was very very low and anxious before the intake and that was reliefed after 30 minutes. I had a little "opiate warmth" spreading inside but not much at all. I just felt comfortable and it was like a very mild codeine dose (very mild for me is 200mg Codeine) I would like to believe that a higher dose of Kratom will give me a more strong high. Today I took 2/3 of 10g bag and feel extremely little effect. Too bad since it is so expensive.

I like the Kratom effect that I experienced a lot and I will buy more Kratom but the dose will have to be at least 10g and it is too bad it lasts so short. I'd like to go for the puppy tea too but then I'm right back at the "real" opiates again.

I will soon get back to you about whether Kratom shows up as positive on opiates on a regular urine drug test. I will go tomorrow with only Kratom (from the opiates realms, at least) and Alprazolam in my blood. It has passed enough time since I quit this period of Tramadol to eliminate the chance of it to show up. I do hope Kratom won't show positive. Cross your fingers.

Cheers to you all.

 

[Morphine]

Now I can let you know about Kratom vs. drugtest.

Today I did my regular drugtest as I do twice a week. It is a simple test from urine and I don't know the name of the particular testprocedure but they just put a plastic stick, about ~4cm wide, into the test and it will shortly show either positive or negative on 4 groups: amphetamines, THC, bensodiazepines and opioids.

I did ingest 25g of Kratom powder divided on 3 occasions during a period of ~28 hours. Last dose ingested 21 hours before the test was made and I'm happy to say the result was negative on opiates :dancing:

I din't expect it to show up positive but I was not sure but now I feel pretty fine knowing it won't cause me any trouble to use it while taking tests.

Further, I made a good tasting mixture of 15g+ Kratom powder this afternoon and it didnt give near the same effect that the 10g did the day before yesterday. So there is a potential tolerance here at least for me.

I find it very satisfying, though, that the effect on me is lasting for quite a long time despite all I've read about it only lasting for a maximum of like 2-3 hours. As I m studying at the moment (from home to get some grades for university later on) I'm thankful to feel something like a mixture of the effect that a very low dose of speed combined with some codeine or a low dose of oxycontine. I get some nice sweatings (the pleasant ones that opiates gives you) after about 2-3 hours along with energy, increased concentration, some light ephouric feelings and alertness that lasts for several hours on. So I was quite surprised to notice this effect and I'm happy with it.

The negatives are that it is damn expensive when you have to ingest 15-20g a time considering it's price. Too bad I got to like this substance since I'm a broke papa.

Anyways, thumbs up for Kratom - let's hope it will stay legal and that ******* will keep on selling it. Next I will go for the "Kat", (Catha Edulis), to see if it is something nice Let me know if you have any experience of that one. Maybe in another thread.

Well... time for sleeping pills and some nice dreams :snore:.

Take care.

Regards,
Morphine

 

[tryptonaut]

I got my 15x extract today and I am just about to test it.

The stuff is brown powder - it looks almost like heroin, LOL
You can snort it which I've done about an hour ago with a smaller amount (one small line) when I left work. I just love snorting stuff...
I went to the supermarket and then home, it was snowing heavily but I enjoyed walking which is a good sign (the usual subtle but nice effect of smaller amounts of kratom, you just feel good and enjoy everything you do).

I had a cup of cocoa now with roughly 2g of the extract. The taste is much better than the old resin extract, you can hardly taste it in the cocoa.
From what I'm feeling right now (15 minutes later), the effects equal 4-5g of the old resin extract. Let's see if it's also getting stronger in the next 30-40 minutes

 

[Arafat]

Is it worth to buy it as a first timer :?: I heard you guys talk about and now I'm curious, so if you can tell me how it's like, if have looked on some websites but they were not verry clear, so if somebody can tell me how it's like maybe I'm gonna try it to, and what's the dose you should take :?:

 

[tryptonaut]

Ok, it got stronger, it seems to be good. I'd say 2g of the 15x extract is about the same as maybe 4-5g of the old resin extract.
However there is a little difference, I think: it leaves you more active and it's not as bad for your stomach.

About an hour ago I thought that maybe the 2g of the 15x extract weren't as strong as 4-5g of the resin extract, maybe more like 3g or so. Then I smoked a cigarette and was told differently... it was like 5g then... I became a little nauseous at first and had to lie down. I was able to switch on the Gladiators before and I lay on my bed for an hour listening to music, it was beautiful.

I'm not sure why nicotine has such a strong effect on Kratom, but it really takes you down (if you can lie down immediately it's nice, but don't do it when you can't lie down!).
Now I'm fit again, still being buzzed by the Kratom of course.

The 15x extract seems to give me roughly the same effect as the old resin extract, only with half the dose. However I think it is a little less of a downer, therefore lacking a bit of the deep buzz the resin extract gave me with high doses. Maybe I just need a little more, I'll try immediately


Arafat, Kratom gives you an opiate-like effect, making you feel extremely well and "smooth". In lower doses it doesn't sedate you at all (unlike opiates) in higher doses you might need to lie down (just like opiates).
Some people say they don't like it, some people love it. You'll have to try it yourself, I guess...

 

[Arafat]

It sounds nice, I think I will trie it when I got enough money to buy things again From what I've readed and what you say I think I'll give it a try myself, if I don't like it I will not tough it again, so I just have to find out